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Episode 204: HubSpot and COVID

Welcome to HubShots Episode 204: HubSpot and COVID

This episode we discuss HubSpot and some covid learnings.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/204-hubspot-and-covid

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Recorded: Thursday 21 May 2020 | Published: Friday 29 May 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

We’ve deliberately resisted talking about the coronavirus situation in the last few months. This episode we’re making a change to chat about some responses and learnings.

Inbound 2020 Goes Online Only

INBOUND 2020 will be moving to September 22–23 and be ONLINE!

So now is the chance to be part of it!

They have a full list of FAQs here using the Service Hub knowledge base!

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

HubSpot Dashboards bulk up

HubSpot has increased the number of dashboards in all HUBS!

  • Starter: 10 (previously 3)
  • Professional: 25 (previously 5)
  • Enterprise: 50 (previously 25)

If you use Pro you can now add twenty reports to a dashboard (previously ten).

Time to go to the Dashboard library and get started.  One of the things we have been doing is creating individual sales rep dashboards.

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

HubSpot Research on COVID impact

HubSpot has compiled data across all their customer portals to provide insights into how the coronavirus has impacted sales and marketing activities and results. It allows drilling in via regions, industries and company sizes.

For example, in APAC here’s how deal creation has been impacted – notice the drop against benchmark begins in early March and reaches its bottom in early April. By early May it is on the up and returning back to normal:

deals created by region

And here’s the Deal closure rates have followed suit:

deals closed by region

The trend indicates that deals are starting to close again.

The trend is similar across all regions:

deals closed by region 1

Shot 4: HubSpot Stumper of the Week

Listener question: Reporting on Contact Journey

How would you answer this listener question?

How to report on a customer journey in HubSpot backwards:

  • eg for all SQLs what was their last interaction, the interaction before and so on.
  • You can read all this stuff from the timeline, but how to put this in a report?

Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Connecting a HubSpot portal to Shopify and you start to see products and you get excited thinking you can use it to add to deals.  Sadly this is only good if you have Sales Pro or Enterprise!

Bonus: if you import a contact from your phone via the HubSpot app and it exists, it will update details and assign the contact to you even though it may be already assigned to someone else. Wat?

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

Facebook and Instagram Shop Functionality. Finally.

We’ve been waiting for this for a while now, and it finally appears to be rolling out (or announced at least!). Ignore the messaging around it being a response to how businesses are struggling due to the coronavirus situation btw.

Facebook is adding functionality to allow product catalogs and purchases on Facebook (and later Instagram) with payment and customer support available on WhatsApp and Messenger as well.

The Verge also has a good overview of it.

Don’t build your empire on sand though, consider Facebook as a complimentary channel, not your only channel. Integrations with Shopify, BigCommerce and other ecommerce platforms are a key part – make sure you include these in your planning.

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

Let’s Talk About Global Covid Learnings

It’s been two months since most of the coronavirus impacts started. We’ve deliberately waited a while before discussing the topic on the show.

Some thought-provoking articles we’ve found useful include:

  • Benedict Evans detailing how the current crisis has accelerated changes, and how the advertising behaviours of industries tend not to revert back after a crisis (he looks at television, radio, print in the wake of the GFC and other global events). Key takeaway: things are changing rapidly and permanently
  • Accenture exploring the human experiences that are changing as a result – including people’s confidence levels, the effects of isolation and how every company is now becoming a ‘health company’ of sorts in terms of the HR functions and processes.
  • Google is halving their own internal marketing budgets – but this mostly by cutting work done by outside agencies. This is in addition to them slowing their hiring.
  • Google’s search results for ‘coronavirus’ show a neat sidebar option, that allows drilling into the intent of the query. Mordy Oberstein at SEL has a compelling article on how this could be adapted to all search results:
    coronavirus serp

Shot 8: HubShots Throwback of the Week

HubShots episode 159 we spoke about HubSpot Academy and the free courses available that is even greater now!

Courses   Lessons   HubSpot Academy

Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Three HubSpot podcasts

Corina Duffy has an enlightening  interview with Tammy Duggan-Herd on the HubCast.

Moby Siddique has an insightful interview with Luke Summerfield on InboundBuzz.

Adam Steinhardt and Zaahn Johnson are back after a break for a few months on HubnSpoke. In episode 58 they continue their discussion around 11 free features of HubSpot.

Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“almost every technology that has connected people who live apart has also created new barriers between people who live close together.”

― Brad Smith, Tools and Weapons: The Promise and the Peril of the Digital Age

Shot 11: Bonus Links of the Week

Enterprise Software Growth becomes a zero-sum game

John Luttig presents a striking insight into the changing penetration of enterprise software – moving from open fields to zero sum game – growth will come at the expense of competitors. A key takeaway is that budgets will shift from R&D to sales and marketing.

Shot 12: Follow Us on the Socials

Connect with HubShots here: HubShots YouTube channel – HubShots Spotify channel – HubShots Facebook group – HubShots Twitter – HubShots Instagram – HubShots LinkedIn

Connect with Ian Jacob on LinkedIn and Craig Bailey on LinkedIn

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 204 HubSpot and COVID

Full Transcript of the Episode

– Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots Episode 204. In this episode, we discuss HubSpot and some Covid learnings. You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one HubSpot-focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks, and strategies for growing your sales, marketing, and service results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search and Be Found and with me is Craig Bailey from Xen Systems. How are ya, Craig?

– I’m well, Ian, and as you allured to, we’re going to talk about Covid tonight and we’ve deliberately resisted talking about this in the last couple of months, but we are going to make a change, an exception tonight, just because there are some learnings and also some responses, I guess from HubSpot, especially, which we’ll chat about now in terms of how they’re going to change the way Inbound is run this year.

– Correct, so this year they’ve just announced Inbound 2020 will be online and it will be moving from August in to September, so September 22nd and 23rd, and now’s your chance to be a part of it, all the time that we talk about stuff, now’s your time to be a part of it and they have a full list of FAQs and if you have a look, and you’re using HubSpot, you’ll notice that it’s using Service Hub Knowledge Base. So have a look and it’s your option to register and be a part of something that you might not necessarily be able to get to, so I encourage everyone to join in.

– Yeah, registration opens on the 1st of June which will be a day or two after this episode goes live, so good timing, check it out, and I think it’s going to be interesting what they edit out because they’re going from four days down to two days, so I’m sure the program will change, but it’ll still be a very worthwhile event.

– All right, Craig, and our marketing feature of the week is HubSpot Dashboards, and now, what do you do, you get more.

– You get more, I’ve said they’re bulking up.

– That’s what Dashboard just grew better, Craig.

– If you were using HubSpot and you were thinking, “I would love another dashboard and I don’t want to pay for the reporting add-on”, well, now if you’re on this data plan, you had three dashboards, it’s now ten, if you were on pro, you had five and it’s gone to 25, and if you were on enterprise it is now 50 as opposed to 25. Now if you use pro, you used to be only able to have ten widgets on that dashboard, now that’s been increased up to 20 reports, so it’s an increase in every way.

– That in itself is not particularly interesting, but what is interesting or useful is actually what’s that meant in your response to it, Ian, so how have you embraced this extra reporting capability?

– So, we’ve started creating individual dashboards for each person on the sales team so they can track their metrics and I’ve also now started going in to the basic dashboards where you can set up ABM dashboards, marketing, website, and just use some of the ones that are pre-prepared as a launching pad to get to the next one but I think it’s a really good start.

– All right, Craig, our HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week.

– Okay, so not so much a feature of the product, but a feature of HubSpot’s research related to sales. So you may have already seen this, they have been promoting it widely on the socials, but worth calling out if you haven’t had a look yet, and it’s the insights that they’ve gathered from across all their 70,000 customer portals and they’ve pulled together insights around deals, marketing activities, and the like. Tonight I was just going to mention the Deals activity, so, you can drill into Deals Created and Deals Closed, you can drill in by region, industry, and work out the trends. We’ve got some screenshots and what I found interesting, I looked at APAC because we’re in APAC, a lot of our clients are, and in the show notes, I’ve got some screenshots there just about Deals Created and what you can see is related to the benchmark, it’s very clear at the start of March, the number of deals being created drops significantly, it bottoms out at the end of March, early April, and what’s happening is that now at the start of May, we’re seeing that pick up again. The number of deals we’ve created is kind of returning to normal and more importantly, the deals being closed follows a similar trend and that trend as well as APAC, which is what I was interested in, is common across all the regions, so we’re seeing this real dip as the pandemic took hold, and we’re seeing, I feel a positivity towards spending again so deals closing. Worth checking out and drilling into the other activities as well, marketing, sales, and marketing e-mail, Openwave and things like that as well.

– Craig, you know one thing with the deals closed by region that stood out to me is that the rate of increase of deals being closed in APAC and EMEA seem to be on par versus that of Latin America and North America which is a lot flatter, so, that is interesting I think that’s reflective of the region and what’s going on, I guess.

– All right, Craig we’ve got a HubSpots Stumper of the Week, tell us more.

– All right, so we ask our listeners, hit us up if you’ve got any questions, any way we can help you out and thank you to the listeners that do contact us on LinkedIn. One of the questions we had, this was a really good one by Martin, I won’t call him out in his full name, but thanks for this one and he’s asking around reporting on a contact journey, or a customer journey, really, but a contact, and his question is how would you report on it, say you’ve got the SQLs, you’ve got a list of SQLs, Sales Qualified Leads, and you wanted to report on what their last interaction was, the interaction before that, the interaction before that. Now, of course, you can go to the timeline of each individual contact and you see all of that, that’s the wonderful thing about the timeline, but how do you report on it in a report that you can send around or in a more aggregated fashion, say for a list of contacts? It’s a really good question and I don’t have an answer for it, and that’s why we’ve called it the Stumper of the Week. We’ve been looking at attribution reports as had this person that asked the question as well, you do get some insight into that but it’s not really in the format that we’re after, here, and the interactions, keep in mind, could be things like, they could be a significant website visit, they could be e-mail opens, they could be engagements with sales, they could be a number of things like that that you might want to define as part of your reporting, so, the reason we’ve put it in Stumper of the Week is listeners, do you actually have an answer? How would you answer, so, perhaps you can help us. Hit us up on LinkedIn or send either of us an e-mail in terms of your insights. How do you report on that kind of stuff, it would be very useful to know.

– All right, Craig, HubSpot Gotcha of the Week, and I’m sure some people might have seen this and we’ve been connecting quite a few HubSpot portals to Shopify lately and while I was training a customer, I was like, “Okay, cool, we can see all the products coming in, we’ve got the e-commerce pipeline, we can nicely see this happening.” and they said “Oh, now if someone calls up on the phone, I’d love to be able to put this in and select the products, can we do that?” I’m like, “Hm, I don’t see why not.” Anyway, you see this, you can drill down, and you can see the products. If you’re on starter, you cannot edit any products or add products to a deal, so, that’s why we call it the Gotcha of the Week and you gotta have Sales Professional or Sales Enterprise to make this happen. Here’s a bonus Gotcha for the Week, Craig, And maybe this might be right, it might be wrong, but I was showing someone in sales about adding a contact to their phone and then using the HubSpot app to import their contact into HubSpot as opposed to entering it manually means that they’ve got a record of it and sometimes it’s more natural just to collect the contact on their phone or they might get forwarded that contact and they save it to their phone before they upload it. Anyway, this contact was in HubSpot already, they imported the contact via the app on their phone, went into HubSpot, had a look, contact didn’t have a number before so the number got updated, and the contact owner got to change the person that imported the contact. Now this contact was owned by a different owner beforehand and so we checked it by looking at the history and went, “Oh, hang on, somebody else had that.” So we had to reassign it back to that person, so just be aware of this if you upload a contact and they already exist, they will get assigned to you even though they were assigned to another person in Sales.

– That’s definitely a Gotcha, that’s a Bug of the Week, surely.

– I think it is.

– Are you sure there’s no option if you import and override that it changes the contact owner? I guess I can understand the logic behind it because if you’re importing it, “Oh, this is my contact,” I can understand that but surely there should be an option.

– I have a feeling, Craig, that they are not checking, the assumption is that if it’s being imported that it’s always the owner and it’s not being checked to see whether the owner is different or who is importing it. All right Craig, now our Marketing Tip of the Week, Facebook-Instagram Shop functionality is finally coming.

– Just ignore the messaging where they say “In the response to the difficult circumstances that we’re under due to Covid…” and by the way, that’s why we included Tinley, that we included this under the Covid episode. Just ignore that, because of course they’ve been working on this for years as we’ve talked about on the show, when’s it coming, especially on the Instagram side and by the way, this is an announcement, so some of the stuff is appearing in Facebook but it’s not on Instagram until later in the year, so there goes that messaging in response here where we’re losing and oh, by the way, you can’t get it now, it’s coming later, but this is really good, I think, as we’ve said on the show earlier, having this whole e-commerce part of Facebook and Instagram especially, where has it been, of course this is the natural next step, what’s going to be good about this is you can purchase on those platforms but also by WhatsApp and Messenger, it’s coming, and you can get customer support through those, the Facebook Messenger or WhatsApp Messenger, so it all looks quite integrated from the Facebook announcement which, let’s just be clear, is a press release we look forward to using this ourselves, but why are we including this in the show because it’s nothing to do with HubSpot, but it is around functionality that marketers need to be thinking about and the takeaway that I wanted to mention from this is that just be careful you don’t build your empire

– On somebody else’s land.

– On somebody else’s land, that’s right. So, consider this a compliment to your existing e-commerce strategy through Shopify or Teachable or other platforms as well, unless you’re just a small business starting out, I wouldn’t put all your eggs in one basket, but just be careful, I think that’s what we always say, don’t we? You’ve got to be careful, embrace this functionality, make it part of your strategy, but don’t rely on it alone, especially when some of those things aren’t even yet out in Anga and they’re only announcements.

– Correct, and I think one thing they’re gonna do is they said that they’re working with partners like Shopify, Big Commerce, and other e-commerce platforms to make this an integral part, just like Google is with their shopping things, I think this will just change the landscape of the way people shop.

– All right Craig, our Insight of the Week, let’s talk about the global Covid learnings.

– All right, so I’ve had a bunch of these links ready for weeks, I’ve been putting off talking about it so some of these are quite old, up to six weeks ago when we were first reading them, but I just wanted to list them out because it’s insightful in some ways or instructive to look at what people were talking about a month ago and then what they were talking about a week ago, but Benedict Evans, who we’ve featured on the show many times, he talks about how the current crisis has accelerated change, I don’t think that’s a surprise to anyone, however, he has some good examples and then he looks at how whole advertising behaviors of industries have changed, and they tend not to revert back. This is the key insight, I feel, so he looked at TV advertising, radio advertising, and in times of crisis like GFC, things like that, people withdraw from them, but they don’t go back in when the crisis or the event is over. So we’re gonna see things like that in the wake of this one, so, things will change rapidly and permanently, that’s the comment there. So, the push to digital and that’s, of course, in Australia, we’re seeing a consolidation in say, print media and a whole bunch of print magazines just being, well I say paused, but just putting on hold, and I’m sure that’s globally that’s happening as well. Even digital, people have pulled out of their spend there. Some of it will go back and there are opportunities, of course, as we’ve talked about in previous shows about getting less expensive clicks at the moment, but then moving on to the human experiences, Extensia had a good study looking at how people’s confidence levels are changing and the effects of isolation, but in particular, how every company is becoming a health company of sorts. So that needs to be part of your culture now, it needs to be part of your HR policies, I thought it was quite startling that Google is halving their own internal marketing budgets. That’s in two parts, they’re slowing their hiring, of course, but they’re mostly cutting back work done by outside agencies, so they’re keeping their own staff, but they’re reducing the budgets on outside agencies, so expect your Google support quality to drop significantly because they do outsource a lot of that.

– And you know, Craig, I was gonna say, I’ve also been reading that Google had a whole bunch of property deals that were supposed to be for new offices and even that’s all being cut, so, we’re not just talking digital, we’re talking actual physical space and how people are working also changing.

– That’s a good example, real estate’s going to be really impacted, of course, cities, the composition of workers versus residential, that ratio may change. Also I was listening to the Dithering podcast with John Gruber and Ben Thompson this week. Just simple things, like going to the movies, cinemas, some people will be craving to go back to the movies but many people won’t, they won’t want to go in big crowds, to a house at a strip show, things like that will permanently change and of course, finally, the Google search results. An article on Search Engine Land just about how Google has added this tab on the left hand side. We’ve got a screen shot in the show notes, if you search for the term “Coronavirus”, that search has no intent associated with it, so you don’t know, are you searching for statistics, are you searching for treatments, things like that. Google is now adding this tab or a sidebar where you actually drill into intent, you’re actually filtering on the intent of your keyword search and the article, Mordy Oberstein speculates, will this change the way search results happen? Because previously, Google would try and guess what your intent was, but now it’s giving you the tools to just filter down on intent, so, changes there as well, so, all as a response of just what’s happened in the last few months, fascinating times.

– All right, now our HubShot Throwback of the Week, Craig, and this was to do within Episode 159, we spoke about HubSpot Academy and some great training that was in there and you know, a year on, I would say it’s getting better and it’s well-organized and there are lots more free courses to get started on, so, I would encourage people if you’re even using Starter or you’re considering or you’re just listening to this podcast, that is a great place to start, go educate yourself. The most simplest thing this week that I have told people is like, educate yourself on if you want to know about buyer personas or you want to know how to create a great marketing plan. There are some really simple things in there that you can learn, and so it’s a great place to head so I’ll put a link in the show notes to that. Now Craig, we’ve got a few Resources of the Week and they’re all podcasts.

– First up, Carina Duffy, she had an enlightening interview with Tammy Duggan-Herd on the Hubcast, and you know, we love Carina, and her chat with Tammy in the podcast, they talk about the flywheel and how it came from a concept to actually getting mindshare. So if you want some insights on how that’s all traveled and perhaps wasn’t well-received at the start but is now much better understood, that’s a good one. Moby Siddique’s back and he had a really insightful interview with Luke Summerfield on HubSpot CMS, of course, but also around what a product owner or a go-to-market lead is responsible for and then finally Adam Steinhardt and Zaahn Johnson, they’re back. They took a break

– They did.

– And Hubnspoke, and they’re back with part two of what they started a couple of months ago, it’s classic. So, they started it and then there was this break and then they’re back to finish it, so, good to hear again, back in Hubnspoke.

– That’s right, now Craig, our Quote of the Week, it’s from a book you’re reading from Brad Smith called “Tools and Weapons: The Promise and the Peril of the Digital Age” and the quote is “Almost every technology that has connected people who live apart has also created new barriers between people who live close together.” When I first read this quote to you, you went “What the…” and you’re like, “I don’t get that.” Anyway, you get it now, right?

– I get it now because we know all too well everyone sitting around in a room, we don’t know each other but we’re all on our phones chatting with people on the other side of the world, so, connected in some ways and isolated in others.

– And now, listen, we’ve got some bonus links in the show and it talks about enterprise software growth becoming a zero sum game and I think there’s some great reading there. We’d appreciate it if you’d follow us on the socials, we are on YouTube by the way, and the videos of us recording this podcast, where you can actually see us will be on there shortly, but I would encourage listeners, go subscribe to the channel so you can get notified and you can watch us if you so please. And again, thank you so much for listening, thank you so much for reaching out to us on LinkedIn, thank you so much for submitting your questions, and again, the offer is there if you do need help with anything during this period, please feel free to contact Craig or myself and we will surely help your guys. Well, Craig, until next week.

– Catch you later, Ian.

– Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at HubShots.com.

Episode 203 HubSpot ABM V2

Episode 203: HubSpot ABM V2

Welcome to HubShots Episode 203: HubSpot ABM V2

This episode we chat about further improvements to HubSpot’s ABM approach including new functionality, plus Google’s May algorithm update.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/203-hubspot-abm-v2

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Recorded: Thursday 14 May 2020 | Published: Friday 22 May 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Interesting Tweet from David C. Baker

Loved David C. Baker’s tweet about using words instead of interesting:


Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Property Recycle Bin

HubSpot released so many cool things in April – too many to cover last episode, this episode we cover the Property Recycle Bin.

If a property is deleted from a Contact, Company or Deal it goes into a Deleted Properties tab:

hubspot property recycle bin

Gotcha: the Delete confirmation form still mentions it can’t be undone…hubspot property delete

Q: What would you expect for any values that contact records had in a property that was deleted? If the property was restored, would you expect the values to be restored on the contact record as well?

A: Yes, the values are restored as well.

Q: Further, if you had set the property to be part of a Customised view, would you expect it to automatically reappear in the view if the property was restored?

A: They don’t appear back in the view automatically, but if you visit the Customised view setup, it will be restored there – you just need to re-save the view and it will appear on Contact records again.

Very impressive!

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

HubSpot ABM Evolved

Back in episode 190 we discussed HubSpot Account Based Marketing (ABM) functionality starting to roll out. At the time we noted that the updates were quite simple to start with, but it was refreshing to see it being pushed out as a natural part of the marketing and sales process.

We’re happy to see that the new set of functionality around ABM is now rolling out. Starting with the Target Accounts feature.

New Target accounts under Contacts

Reports dashboard 21

Making it clear to those working on target accounts what the value is and when accounts were last touched and engaged with.

Another thing is the Prospects tool coming into visibility to the sales team from this screen!

Target Accounts

Prospects Tip: Hide ISP and non-company sources

Depending on the business you are in, you may find a lot of the prospect traffic is just ISPs.

You can filter some of this out using the ‘Internet service provider’ filter:

hubspot prospects 1

For others you can Hide them from the listing:

hubspot prospects 2

Note: you can’t Unhide prospects that you have previously Hidden!

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

If you have enabled GDPR and have imported your customer contacts and are seeing in the system that you don’t  have a lawful reason to communicate with then you can set them up from the contact screen by doing this:

Contacts 4

Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Can’t Unhide Prospects you have marked to Hide

According to this HubSpot Community post you can’t Unhide prospects that have been set to hidden in the Prospects listing.

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

You can Work Hard on SEO, but you can Never Guarantee Results

Google has been rolling out a core algorithm update since 05 May 2020 – being referred to as the May 2020 Core Update.

Here’s an example of an Australian client who has seen improvement:

google organic trend

It’s important to note that there have been no other significant changes – no changes to site content, architecture, technical SEO, link building, etc. This is purely an algorithm change.

It highlights just how un-guarantee-able Google ranking improvements are.

This could just as likely reverse in the coming months if Google releases another major algorithm update that changes other things.

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

McKinsey Report on Consumer Sentiment

McKinsey released findings of a Consumer Sentiment survey they conducted at the end of April 2020. The details are available here, and their commentary is available here.

Two slides in the Australian insights caught my attention – they cover the changes to consumer digital behaviours that will stick.

First though, some caveats:

  • Customer surveys are problematic at the best of times
  • Steve Jobs famously never used them, Federal election polls are notoriously terrible at capturing actual sentiment…
  • That said: what people say they want to do is different to what they actually do and this report is about changes that have happened…

Here’s the matrix they used for grouping behavior changes. We are interested in the top right section – accelerated shifts that are going to stick:

mckinsey 1

Check these findings (see the red arrows):

mckinsey 2

Key takeaways: Opportunities for business:

  • New distractions (TikTok) that continue
  • Remote learning staying (not returning to in-person for segments of people)
  • Internal processes around wellness
    • recruitment opportunity
    • retention opportunity
    • See also Accenture research – point 03 (link)
  • Notice though (top left quadrant) that people expect their behaviour around videoconferencing and virtual hangouts to slip back to old ways.

Shot 8: HubShots Throwback of the Week

Just 13 episodes ago we were talking about HubSpot’s first round of ABM features rolling out. Now we’re seeing the next stage of this – and it’s really good.

Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Fast or Slow by WordFence

Another handy tool for measuring your website performance is Fast or Slow by the WordFence team.

It is based on Google’s Lighthouse automated testing tool – which can appear ‘inconsistent’ as it is based on current conditions and comparisons with other site eg here’s two separate tests minutes apart – notice they have different scores:

fast or slow 1

Test 2:

fast or slow 2

Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“Test results beat Twitter opinions.” John Mueller (on Twitter)

johnmu quote

Btw I love how John still uses a Google+ link in his Twitter bio:

johnmu bio

Shot 11: Bonus Links of the Week

How to remove URLs from Google

Patrick Stox over at ahrefs has a good post on how to remove URLs from Google. Includes the main scenarios eg removing sensitive content on your own site, versus updating to new content, through to requesting content be removed on another site that you don’t control. The full post is worth reading, as it goes through the following flow chart:

how to remove urls from google search 1

As a general comment: when we want to remove content on sites we own, we usually see if we can redirect the page to another page that is more appropriate/updated.

If no other page is appropriate to redirect to, then we first noindex it, then wait for it to be crawled and confirm it is removed from the index, then delete the page.

Shot 12: Follow Us on the Socials

Connect with HubShots here: HubShots YouTube channel – HubShots Spotify channel – HubShots Facebook group – HubShots Twitter – HubShots Instagram – HubShots LinkedIn

Connect with Ian Jacob on LinkedIn and Craig Bailey on LinkedIn

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 203 HubSpot ABM V2

Full Transcript of HubShots Episode 203

– Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 203. In this episode, we talk about, HubSpot’s ABM approach to building new functionality. And Google May algorithm update. You’re listening to Asia-Pacific’s number one HubSpot focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks, and strategies for growing our sales, service, and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are ya Craig?

– Well, interesting that you should ask Ian, did you see this Tweet from David C. Baker? We love David C. Baker, friend of the show.

– We do.

– Do you listen to his 2Bobs podcast, by the way?

– I haven’t recently, but I have, yes.

– Oh, I love it, great advice for agencies. But anyway, he puts on the side of his computer, he puts this list of words he can say instead of using the word interesting. And I know I say this all the time, I overuse the word interesting, “Oh this is interesting, this is an interesting article, “I find this interesting.”

– Well let’s go through some words Craig.

– Yeah, okay, so what were some of your favorites on this list?

– Alluring, delightful.

– Compelling.

– Compelling, yeah that’s right.

– Stimulating, that was an interesting one.

– And you got striking, thought provoking.

– And unusual finished off that list,

– Yeah.

– But, you know, this is really interesting.

– Okay, our goal, Ian, is to get them into the show, try and get as many of those as we can into the show.

– That’s right. Now Craig, we have got a HubSpot marketing feature of the week, and this is to do with the Property Recycling Bin.

– Well here’s a delightful feature of HubSpot. And we’ll only spend a minute or two on this, and I think well, what could be more boring than a recycle bin for properties? But I think it’s really good and it’s just part of their recycle bin strategy throughout the product. It’s almost like you can’t really make a fatal mistake anymore, you can’t really delete anything, and it’s problematic, because it goes to recycle bin, and you can restore it, so, this was one of their April updates, as we said last episode, too many to cover in last week’s show so we’re covering the property recycle bin this week. Now I will just highlight, we’ve got some screenshots. Let’s say in your settings, you’re in the properties, and a contact property or a company property or a deal, you can delete it, it goes into the recycle bin, I think you’ve got 90 days to restore it. I noticed that when I did delete it, it still actually popped up in the popup and said this can’t be undone, so they’ve gotta change that, so don’t be too terrified by that, because now you can restore it. But I have two questions for you, and let’s say you’ve created a property, a custom property, on a contact. Then you’d delete it. Now, say that property had been on a lotta contacts, and on those contacts you’d fill that out, you’d put actually data into those properties. So you delete the custom property. So it goes to the recycle bin, then you restore it, now would you expect, okay, the field that will appear again, that gets contacts or companies or whatever, would you expect the data that was in there previously to be restored as well?

– Yes.

– Correct, so you would expect that, and of course that’s what you’d want. Imagine if you had thousands of records, delete the custom property, and then you restore it, and none of the data came back, you’d be like “Oh great, so it saved me “the one second to restore the property, “but none of the value.” So that’s restored, okay, second question, because this is my life, this is the kinda stuff that I like to play with. Let’s say you’ve set up a customized view, with that property, in your custom view, say for a contact layout. You delete the property, okay, it disappears from the custom view. You restore the property, do you expect it to come back into the custom view or not?

– Into the custom view, I would say so.

– So by default, it doesn’t, when you go and refresh the contact here, oh no, it’s not there. But, if you look at the customized view, it is actually there in the setup, so you just save the view again. And ta-da, then it appears back on the actual contact records, or company records, et cetera. So I thought that was impressive, I’m happy with that, well done HubSpot for just having one of these little incremental improvements, that they roll out in the product, so we’ve put that in the Marketing Feature of the Week, but that is nowhere near as exciting as our next shot, is it Ian?

– No, that’s right. And this is the HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week Craig, and this is to do with account-based marketing. Now in episode 190 we discussed how HubSpot account-based marketing functionality was rolling out. And some of the functionality, you might not have seen, because there were properties, and then there was a dashboard to go with it, so, one of the things you would see back in 190, we talked about some of those properties, and we said how we set them up in the portal so it’s visible to the team. Now, what’s interesting here, is that under Contacts, we see a new menu item called Target Accounts. And this is what we’re going after, right? And I got excited when I saw it this week. And just before I went to a sales meeting with one of our customers, and I thought, “Oh, this is really good.” And then I went, and it essentially showed you, kind of like an overview dashboard of your target account, so it said, how many target accounts you had, how many accounts with open deals there were, what the value of those open deals or what the average of the open deals were. What was missing, or should I say, the context that we’re missing, buying role, so this is another key aspect. So, you can target an account, but within that you have buying roles, and that’s one of the inputs that you need to complete, to make sure you’ve got this filled out. And then the other really key aspect was, how many decision makers are missing, so really is working on having good data here, and it was really clear, to understand, and it gave a percentage of what that was, so it gave a number, so in this example that we had that was 38, but it was 70% of the accounts that we had targeted, that didn’t have this. And then on the left-hand side there’s a nice menu which basically breaks it down, as to who those people are, from, are they blockers, are they decision makes, et cetera. And just below that, another great feature was, here are the companies we’re targeting. And, how many associated contacts, the number of open deals. The total value of those deals. And then here were the next two things that are really interesting. And I essentially told the sales team, I’m looking at these target accounts. And, it had the last touch. The last engagement. And what the next scheduled activity was. And to my surprise, a lotta those hadn’t been touched for months. There was no scheduled activity, there was no last engagement, and it really highlighted to me, as much as we were putting data in and I was encouraging them to highlight and target these accounts. They had actually not done any work with those people, so, at the last sales meeting I said “Look, it’s a good indication as to, “are we actually touching these people, “and are we having conversations, “are we reaching out to the right people? “And A, do we know who the right people are, “in this transaction, and so it was fantastic.”

– Yeah look, this is just rolling out, and I’ll just mention to listeners, so we’re recording this before it’s officially rolled out, but it is appearing in some portals. So the beta’s there, so it’s not as though this is all under NDA or anything. However, there are parts that we’re seeing in some of the partner release training that may not yet be out by the time that you’re listening to this, so, just be aware, there is more stuff coming out. Now I mention that because, a bit of context around this, when we initially talked about this back in episode 190. We almost had a bit of a underwhelmed attitude, I would say, it was like oh, there was a bit of fanfare around, oh, these ABM features. And it was good that they were starting to roll out some pieces, some underlying foundations, shall we say? This, and that’s why we’ve called the show ABM Version Two. This is a much stronger rollout, and this is very actionable, and useful processes for sales teams. So I really like this, I think it’s interesting, it is under the Contacts, oh, I used the word interesting, see, there you go. I think it’s, what’s one of the other words I should use Ian? I think it’s refreshing, shall we say, that it’s under the Contacts menu, and they call it target accounts, which are really just target companies, but I think target accounts is much more of an ABM industry term, so that’s in keeping with normal terminology. And it is really a key part for the sales team, so it’s, there I go, I was gonna say interesting again. So it’s something that could’ve appeared under the sales menu, but they’ve put it under the Contacts menu. And I like the way you laid it out, one of the things that I found in my portal, is that we hadn’t connected contacts to update companies, in terms of owner, so the contact owner, to get updated to the company owner. I hadn’t got that ticked on, in our settings. I’ve put it on now, but unfortunately it’s not retrospective. So when I was looking at our target accounts list, if I chose everyone, I saw that once I chose them, but if I just chose myself. I wasn’t seeing those target companies or those target accounts, I was like, “Why, I know all these contacts, I’m the contact owner.” But I wasn’t the actual company owner, so a little bit of a thing to watch out for there. But I think this is very strong and there are a whole bunch of other things coming out, this is just the start, of what HubSpot’s rolling out, on the ABN front, so very exciting.

– And now the next thing that was on that, Craig, on the left-hand menu was, the link to the Prospects tool. And this is often hidden in Analytics. And not many people look at it, and when I show this to, a lot of our customers, and I say “Hey look, see who’s been on your website,” or they’re going for tenders. And then I go to pull up the tool and they go “Hang on, we just submitted a tender for that.” And they see those people on the site, they’re like “Wow, this is amazing.” So, the fact that ABM has come up and they brought prospects there as well, is a really interesting thing, and I think it really puts it forefront of sales, to really understand who’s on the site, what’s going on, what the interaction is. Now, in saying that, there is an interesting feature in there that you discovered, didn’t you Craig?

– Well, two things to mention. Quite often you’ll see prospects in there and they’re just ISPs, so in Australia you might see Telstra and–

– Foxtel.

– Foxtel and others in there. So you can set one of the filter options, internet service provider, you can set that to false, to filter out some of those, but then there’ll still be a bunch of others that creep in there. So there’s this hide option. So you can choose some of those prospects and just hide them to get them out of your view, and I’ve been doing that to hide ones that aren’t picked up by the other filter. However, the little gotcha is, if you hide them, you can never unhide them. So just be mindful of that, don’t accidentally hide a high prospect, a high intent prospect or anything like that. And we’ve put a link through to the community page on HubSpot where someone’s saying “Why can’t you do it?” And then they’ve said “Oh if you think this is a problem “why don’t you you create an idea?” You know how they love, everything is, “Oh, too hard, just submit it as an idea.” Which I guess is fair enough, the team’ll look at that, but anyway, just a gotcha for people.

– That’s right, and that is our gotcha of the week, Craig. Now, onto our HubSpot extra of the week Craig, and this is to do with, if you have GDPR enabled in your portal.

– First of all, if you have it enabled, my sympathies.

– That’s right Craig, and you know what, it just highlighted to me the amount of extra stuff that needs to go on, that happens with customer communication. And I can almost say it’s another hurdle you’ve gotta jump over.

– It’s onerous, I understand why it’s there, I understand the intent of GDPR, and it’s good, and it’s kept big companies in line, but it’s the small businesses that often suffer with this additional layer of, legislation–

– Complexity.

– That they have to meet, but yes, anyway, you’ve highlighted a nice little tip here.

– And this is while we were migrating a customer over in the UK, into HubSpot, and we were loading in a lot of their customer data. And what you will see often when you’re communicating with people, within the system, is that you’ve gotta have permission, right, or you gotta have the intent correctly. And what was happening, we loaded it in. And then when we tried to run a workflow and send an email or do some email marketing, or maybe even put them in a sequence, for example. It said “Oh, you don’t have any lawful basis “to communicate with this person.” And then we were like “Whoa, what do we do here?” Because, we already have got consent, but HubSpot is not aware of it. So, a really simple way to do it was to, on the Contacts screen, you can go and select the contacts. You can then click the More dropdown and you can add legal basis for processing contact data. And then you can select which category it fits into. And then give a reason, and then it’ll opt everybody in. Now if you don’t have this turned on, you’re not gonna see this feature in the More menus. So if you go, “Oh, I wanna go see what this looks like,” you ain’t gonna see if you don’t have it turned on. But this is a way to make sure that you’ve got the settings correct. This is from HubSpot support, when I was talking to them about this, plus something else, to do with how we’re collecting things on forms. Is to make sure that you have express consent, so basically when you’re collecting data on a form, make sure that you can collect that consent, expressly, so in future if laws change and they say “Oh you need to have this consent,” then you’ve got it, as opposed to “Oh I’m just gonna opt them in, because–“

– Uh, but pretty much if you have GDPR enabled that’s on by default on most forms, I think, it’s that you actually have to take it out deliberately, don’t you?

– Correct, yes, it does, but there’s variations of it, Craig, so there’s somewhere you can say that because they’re filling in this form, it’s expressly saying that they’re communicating with us, and then there’s another option where they have to actually tick a checkbox. And then there’s one with two checkboxes.

– Right, yeah, but that’s the one I mean, doesn’t that appear on forms by default if you’ve got GDPR enabled?

– Yes it does, but there are those three options.

– Right.

– So, that’s that. Now what’s our marketing tip of the week, Craig?

– Alright, onto shot six, this is about Google’s May algorithm update, they’re calling it the May 2020 Core Update, that Google’s rolled out. Now as we know Google’s always testing algorithm updates daily, there’s probably multiple changes going out, but, at certain times during the year, they roll out big algorithm updates, and there’s probably a couple each year, one’s just rolled out in May. We’ve got a screenshot from one of our customers, this is a Google Analytics screenshot just showing the marked or the striking impact of that. You can just see it on the actual day, their traffic basically doubles. The point I wanted to make, and of course they’re very happy, and don’t we look great. And I was telling we have not done anything, there has been no unusual changes. There’s been nothing changed, the site architecture, site content’s the same, technical SEO link builder, no changes there. This is purely an algorithmic change on Google’s behalf. Now to be fair, they have actually worked hard on their site over the last year or two, great content. It’s actually a very good site, but then an algorithm change like this comes along and they benefit markedly from it. And the thing that I wanna highlight it is, so that’s no genius from our point of view, we just followed the numbers, some great content, engaging, et cetera. But the opposite could happen. Because, imagine if that algorithm changes in another month’s time, and their traffic halves. Of course we’re gonna look terrible, probably like “Oh, what’s happened?” Everything’s suddenly dropped to half, and that’s a significant impact, so, this is the point, we’re at the mercy of Google always, and if you ever, dear listener, have an agency, an SEO agency tell you that they can guarantee Google rankings results, run from them. Because, they can advise, and they can do the best they can, as we do, with our clients, but there are no guarantees.

– And Craig I wanna highlight that because, just like we are both Google Partners, and that is one of the first things Google always tells us when we turn up for events. Is that if anybody says that, or they claim that they can get you onto page one, and they can guarantee it, then they’re are not doing the right thing.

– And also there’s an education for clients, we’ve had clients say “Look, we wanna rank number one “for this term, how long will it take?” And we’re like “Well, I can give you some guidance, “but there’s no guarantees.” And they’re like “Oh, look, I’ll pay, “what will it cost to get to number one?” I’m like “It just doesn’t work that way.” So, yeah, it can be some difficult conversations, but I think it’s important that people are aware of just how lack of control we have over what Google implements.

– Google Ads Craig, if you wanna pay.

– Yeah, that’s it, pay to play, pay to play on Google Ads, that’s right.

– Alright, now we’re onto our Insight of the Week, and this is the McKinsey Report on Consumer Sentiment, Craig, now this is something you found. And it looks pretty comprehensive to me. And it’s got some good insights.

– Yeah, I’ve been reading a lot about the impact of COVID on things like behaviors, I’m very interested in how it affects behaviors.

– Yeah.

– And we’ve got a whole bunch of articles to, we’ve actually taken it out of today’s show and we’re gonna talk about them next week instead, ’cause there’s so many. Today I’m just talking about this McKinsey Report, and they did a consumer sentiment survey at the end of April. It was global, quite a few countries and regions covered, we’ve got links in the show notes to the details, and also their commentary around it. I’m gonna highlight two slides from the Australian insights, that caught my attention, so this is just drilling down to consumer sentiment in Australia. And they have a quadrant, I’ll just explain this quadrant, it’s easier if you do look at the screenshots in the show notes, but four quadrants, and it’s talking about, what has changed during the Coronavirus times, and then what they expect they’ll stick with, so once this is post-COVID, shall we say. So what we’re interested in here is one, behavior changes, but two, more importantly the behavior changes that are going to stick. So, interestingly, ah, there I’ve used that word again. Strikingly, things such as use of video conferencing. Sure, that’s risen a lot, as everyone would know, at the moment. But post-COVID, people are not expecting that, they actually want to go back to their normal ways. So that’s something that’s not gonna stick. Here’s some things that are gonna stick, I thought this was fascinating. Can you see that first arrow I’m pointing at there, Ian? Use of TikTok. I’m not kidding you folks. This is a McKinsey Report, okay? And one of their findings is use of TikTok, so I am taking this very seriously. You know, when I think of TikTok, it has two buckets, one, it could go down the path of Instagram, and become mainstream, and get on it early and use it. Or, alternatively, it could go down the path of Snapchat and become a bit of a niche thing that didn’t really pan out. It’s going to be fascinating to see which path TikTok does go down. And, it seems as though it might be going more down the Instagram path, because, what we’re seeing, the user growth almost equals, is very similar, equal to the intent to continue. And that shows, something like TikTok’s usage, people are, well there’s an addiction piece to it. But they are using it and finding value, whether that’s entertainment or just how to waste time, and they continue to use it. The second thing that came out is remote learning, so this is far more understandable. Now why I’m highlighting this is because remote learning, you might say “Well of course that’s increased.” Yes, but will it stick? And this is the behavior change, people are getting used to remote learning. And they will continue with it, that’s what the consumer sentiment is saying. I think this is important for marketers because they would’ve, very quickly many companies have pivoted to “Well we’re gonna go to online learning,” or they call it virtual learning, virtual classrooms and that. But many talk about it as a temporary thing, “Oh, it’s gonna go back, “and people will go back to in-person training events.” This shows that there’s a very defined segment that that will not happen, they will stay with online learning, so this is important for marketers, for your future longer-term planning, to keep that in mind, and there was just a third one which is around wellness, in the company, so part of HR policies’ wellness is gonna become part of corporate culture. So, some interesting insights there. What’s your thoughts on that, Ian?

– I’m surprised with TikTok, Craig. But with the rest, no I’m not surprised, I think people have taken this time, to reevaluate everything that they do from where they work to how they work to how they interact with their family, their friends, and what’s important to them, and I think this is what shows, in these results. Alright Craig, what’s our HubSpot Throwback of the Week, or should we say HubShots Throwback of the Week?

– HubShots, I’m just gonna throw back to episode 190 where we talked about ABM version one. That’s the throwback, and a mere 13 episodes later we’ve got ABM, account-based marketing version two, in a much stronger and more compelling offering.

– Alright, we’ve got a Resource of the Week, now we’ve been talking about site speed a lot, and here’s another site core, fast or slow, by Wordfence, and if you are probably using WordPress, you would’ve probably seen this when you logged into WordPress, there’s a Wordfence plugin. And that’s where you might be familiar with it, but this was an interesting site, wasn’t it Craig, to test out site speed?

– Yeah, yet another one, and I’ve put two screenshots in the show notes, because, for the exact same site, which we’ve done as a test, which is the HubShot site. We get different scores depending on when we run it. The reason for this is because Google’s Lighthouse, automated testing tool which this is built on, will do comparisons, to how your site compares with others, at that point in time. So they kind of do some weighted averages on how you compare to all other sites they’re testing at that moment in time, so we’ve got a screenshot here where we scored 88, and then another one where we’ve scored 91. Due to just the way it responded at that time. So, why am I highlighting that? Well, you can be unlucky, and I’ve had this with some clients, where they’ve run it and got a really low score. And then I’ve run it myself and went, “Oh no, it’s actually okay.” So the point is, run multiple tests, and on multiple pages on your site. Don’t get too fixated on one score, make sure you’ve got a set of scores to work on. And then you can drill through some of their findings, and fix various points. Huge images is always the one that crops up, on a lotta clients’ sites, someone’s gone to the home page, updated the image, and upload a 5 MG image and then wondering why the home page is running a bit slower than usual. So there’s some quick wins there, you can find, and these tools highlight those kinds of factors.

– Now Craig, I just wanted to highlight something that you mentioned. Most people when they run these tests will put in the URL of the website. Say if it’s a .com or a .com.au. When you said, run this on specific pages, are you actually saying to run it on pages that you’re looking at, to find the speed, or we’re talking about this as a site-wide average?

– No, this is a URL by URL normally. There are other tools which will crawl through your site and do multiple pages, this particular one is just a URL at a time. And so, I would say pick the top ten pages. And you can look at analytics to see which of the top ten that people visit. Just make sure they’re highly performin’, and then move on to some of the lesser visited pages as well. You’ll probably find, apart from the obvious gotchas such as huge images that people upload. If there are slow things, for example, lots of scripts or some site-wide images, or site-wide issues, often just fixing that on one page will fix it on the rest of the site anyway.

– Correct, now in terms, I’m gonna talk about this part about scripts. I’ve been doing some work with a customer of ours. And they’ve got a bunch of scripts that are running, and I think that is causing some slowdown, not in massive amounts, but it’s a good time to evaluate, what is running on your site and remove that, if it’s unnecessary. Because, even things like Hot Jar, for example, which we’ve spoken about, where you might look at heat maps or you might be doing some recordings to understand some changes that you have made on the site. Once you’ve done that it’s actually worthwhile you taking that code off, if you’re not using it, because that is adding extra load onto what’s being requested and also what’s being gathered, so, do that. Craig, what’s our Quote of the Week?

– I loved this, this was from John Miller from Google. He’s almost the voice of Google these days, people say “Oh what about this?” and “How does that affect the Google algorithms?” and so they ask him. And he had a question from someone, it’s not important what the question was. But he basically said, “Test it, ’cause test results beat Twitter opinions,” so our quote of the week is “Test results beat Twitter opinions,” and that’s from John Miller, from Google, thanks John, good advice.

– That’s what we tell people, test and measure whatever you do.

– By the way, check out John’s profile. So this is an incredibly influential person, on Twitter, and Google, and he’s got his Google+ link in his bio, I think he’s done it on purpose. It doesn’t work of course, but it’s pretty funny.

– Ah, that’s a distant memory I have to say. Anyway, we’ve got some bonus things of the week Craig, and this is some stuff that you will, obviously not while you’re running or driving, listening to us, but when you get back to your computer, it’s worth checking it out on the site, because there are lots of useful resources that we share, every week.

– I’ll just give the headline, it’s How to Remove URLs from Google, we’ll get clients saying “Oh we’ve got this page in the Google search results, “how do we get rid of it?” Shot 11 of the show, we walk you through it, check that out.

– Yeah, very important. And what I wanna say, is that why it’s important is, that in our show notes, we’ve got a really nice decision-making tree about how you actually get that removed, so have a look at that.

– Alright listeners, we’re at the end of the show and we’d say, we’d love if you would connect with us over LinkedIn, please send us a note that you are listening to this show and that you’re not connecting to sell us stuff. We’d love to hear from you, again, as we go through this period, as we get outta this period, and as things change in the world, Craig and myself are here to help you guys. Please do not be afraid to simply ask, we are happy to jump on a Zoom call with you, and have a chat, and help ya out whenever we can.

– Can I just say, I just wanna apologize in advance, ’cause we have been getting a number of requests, and sometimes it’s taking me a couple of days, to respond to people, and you’ve been helping with some of these Ian, so apologies if we don’t respond straight away, we do get them, thank you, and we will contact you to give you a hand.

– Well Craig, until next week. ♪ Three two ♪

– Catch you later Ian. Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes and the latest HubSpot news and tips, please visit us at hubshots.com.

Episode 202 Agile Marketing HubSpot User Permissions

Episode 202: Agile Marketing, HubSpot User Permissions

Welcome to HubShots Episode 202: Agile Marketing, HubSpot User Permissions

This episode we chat about Agile marketing, HubSpot Email Analysis tools, Task Queues and Improved permissions.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/202-agile-marketing-hubspot-user-permissions

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Recorded: Thursday 07 May 2020 | Published: Friday 15 May 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Reminder: We are on YouTube – which may be of interest to you if you have YT open most of the day on your third monitor.

A favour to ask – would you please Like and leave a comment on our LinkedIn post about our 200th Episode.

Agile Marketing is on the rise

Scott Brinker on his Chief Marketing Technology blog post analyses how Agile Marketing is on the rise.

He mentions the new 3rd Annual State of Agile Marketing report from Agile Sherpas.

A quick oversimplification of agile marketing:

  • Use a clear list (queue) for tasks – in priority (action) order – that everything gets added to
  • Break the tasks into smaller chunks that can be finished quickly
  • Aim to have each person working off a single queue (in Teamwork we have a My Work listing for example)
  • Ideally be able to visualise the queue (this can be hard if working multiple projects/clients though)
  • The number of tasks being worked on will dictate the time they done in (less tasks, quicker completion)
  • Fewer tasks being worked on also helps reduce context switching (but often it is other ‘tasks’ eg email, slack, etc that disrupt context switching)
  • Aim to deliver smaller pieces of work quickly (MVP approach)
  • Daily catchups (standups) help to manage priorities and bottlenecks
  • Weekly/monthly reviews (retrospectives) help to lock in learnings avoid repairing mistakes

A few interesting points from the report:

  • Note: based on 637 (mainly US) marketers who responded
  • Main goal of adopting agile is:
    • Increase productivity
    • Increase speed of delivery
    • Improve quality
    • Easily change priorities
    • Easily show what is being worked on

agile marketing goals

You can download the report from here.

I was interested to note one of their Form field options – it had two main options in the Are you looking for…’ form field, and no way to enter ‘Other’ details – which I found slightly confusing. But wasn’t a problem because it was optional.

3rd Annual State of Agile Marketing Report option

Would have been good to have another option so they could qualify me appropriately.

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Look at the Analyze Marketing Email Section

Lots of great analysis on that page.

We discovered what send times were working based on opens.Marketing Email   HubSpot 4

When you hover over these points it shows you the following that can be very useful!

pasted image 0 17

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Sharing Task Queues

If your subscription is Sales Hub Professional or Enterprise, or Service Hub Professional or Enterprise, you can add users to your task queue.

Tasks 1

What is exciting is that if you have access to the workflows tool or sequences tool, you can create tasks automatically and add those tasks to a shared task queue, allowing different users who are invited to the task queue to view and complete the tasks!

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

HubSpot released so many cool things in April – too many to cover this episode, we’ll cover more next episode including the Property Recycle Bin and Product Properties.

This week we’ll look at the updates they’ve made to user permissions.

Increased Security and Permissions

HubSpot has added the ability to set permissions on specific properties – this is similar to their content partitioning approach ie by adding Teams and Users.

Access it from the Edit Property form:

hubspot property permissions 1

And then add Teams as appropriate:

hubspot property permissions 2

They’ve also added Account Access permissions for users:

hubspot user account settings

One important item to note – the Edit HubDB tables permissions:

hubspot hubdb permissions

This is in addition to the setting under Marketing which are for editing HubDB tables:

hubspot marketing permissions

Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Possible usability issue.  Discovered this when we have a date picker field in HubSpot forms and the default date format is dd-mm-yyyy.  On forms, it shows like this.

https   share hsforms com 1js3tzsNaSB  OVvQ HTU7w4775c

HubSpot are looking at fixing this to read the format of the dates on forms as per the portal setting!

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

B2B Content Marketing Insights

Convince & Convert have released a B2B Content Marketing Trends to Watch in 2020 report (I tend to avoid using the word ‘trends’ if possible, but that’s their choice).

The full report is interesting reading, here’s a few key points:

  • Content goals are largely TOFU focussed
  • 84% use paid distribution
  • Most marketers have metrics for content performance, but less have ROI measurements

One item they mention in their blog post is the focus on fact checking. It is on p21 of the report.

“Most B2B content has promotional aspects. The aim is to get people to take desirable actions, and that often means doing business with a company or at least showing a willingness to learn about them. When asked about their priorities, though, the vast majority of the most successful marketers put their energies into fact-checking and delivering highly informative content for their audiences.”

b2b content marketing trends 2

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

Shopify Released their Shop App

Shopify released an app (full details on the Shop app here) that allows two key functions:

  • Tracking orders (actually this is a rebranding of their earlier Arrive app)
  • Following brands that have Shopify powered stores (currently more than a million globally)

Interesting to note that Ben Thompson at Stratechery didn’t like the app or the strategy behind it (note: membership required to view the article) – he considers Shopify’s key focus and opportunity to be a platform eg via their Shopify Fulfilment Network, instead of getting in the way between shoppers and the merchants (which he refers to as being an aggregator).

Craig likes how it will be a good way to ‘remind’ customers to purchase more – get a notification about an order, and be distracted by the list of deals in the app. Also, I wouldn’t be surprised if Shopify launches a big store website experience (probably not at Shopify.com though) that pulls in products from all of their merchants.

Shopify has also been working on other apps such as their POS console for merchants. And they recently released their Shopify email marketing products as well.

Very exciting to see how this evolves.

Key takeaway: if you are focussing more on your online store presence, then Shopify would be my #1 choice – way ahead of WooCommerce and other ecommerce platforms.

For marketers: focus on Shopify strategy, implementation and integration with your other platforms (eg HubSpot).

Shot 8: HubShots Throwback of the Week

Not much happened in May last year!

Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Keyword Research Tools

Scout Suggest is a free keyword research tool. It’s quite handy for putting in a seed term and then getting a list of suggested search terms – it’s based on Google Autocomplete searches. Note that it is only a list of terms (it’s free after all) there’s no indication of competitiveness, search volume of the value of the terms. SEOScout have a paid tool that includes all this (but full disclaimer: we haven’t used the paid tool as yet).

If you’re looking for a good guide to the value and process of keyword research then this guide from Moz is worth a read. Note: Moz have their own keyword tool as well – with a free offering and paid upgraded version – we’ve used it and it is very good.

Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“Being enthusiastic is worth 25 IQ points.” – Kevin Kelly

Shot 11: Bonus Links of the Week

It’s Time To Build

Marc Andreessen wrote a compelling piece titled: It’s Time To Build. In it he queries why the US hasn’t built more stuff (public transport, housing, education, medical supply chain, manufacturing, farms, technology centers) in order to cope better in times of crisis. It’s interesting to ready, easy to agree with, but hard to determine what (if any) the personal action items are – instead it is a rallying cry for political support.

Shot 12: Follow Us on the Socials

Connect with HubShots here: HubShots YouTube channel – HubShots Spotify channel – HubShots Facebook group – HubShots Twitter – HubShots Instagram – HubShots LinkedIn

Connect with Ian Jacob on LinkedIn and Craig Bailey on LinkedIn

Episode 202 Agile Marketing HubSpot User Permissions

Full Transcript of HubShots Episode 202

– Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 202. A very palindromic number, Craig. In this episode we talk about Agile marketing, HubSpot email analysis tools and tasks queues and improved user permissions. You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one, HubSpot focus podcast where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks and strategies for growing your sales and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you Craig?

– I’m very well and congratulations. What other week for palindromic there! We should add that to the show. One into the week, nicely done.

– Now Craig, we’re past the 200 mark, so growth throughout the week. We wanted to ask listeners if you could please go to our HubShots page on LinkedIn and help us share episode 200.

– Yeah, that’s right. I’m keen to get a few more likes and comments on that one just to get a bit of awareness outside. If you could help us listeners, that’d be really appreciated. If you enjoy the show, that is. Also YouTube, we’re on YouTube and I think, maybe one or two people know that. Given the ones and ones of views we get on each show. But Tara mentioned that she actually listens to the show on YouTube and she’s saying, oh, maybe in this time when everyone’s at home, they’ve just got YouTube sitting in the background. Maybe it’s a good chance to just have HubShots playing along in the background.

– That’s right, and I see what the best part is. She doesn’t have to watch two turkeys that she talk about, about what they’re talking about it. All right, Craig, onto our growth thought of the week. And we’re going to talk about Agile marketing on the rise. Now I’m sure some people that are in our field, are hearing this term tossed around.

– I think if you’re a developer in a past life as both you and I are in Agile marketing, Scrum and Kanban, LinkedIn, all of that, we just know that kind of stuff. And so we take it for granted. So when we hear anything around Agile, we’re like, oh yeah, of course we’ve been doing that for years because most developments have. However, in the marketing space it seems that awareness of this concept is not as well known. And so I thought it was interesting that Scott Brinker raised this on his Chiefmartec blog and he referred to the third annual state of Agile marketing report from Agile shoppers. So I’ve downloaded the report. It was quite interesting and in fact I’ve downloaded a bunch of their eBooks following on that, nice kind of nurturing process they’ve got in place. The report is good, but I thought it might be good just to quickly recap or give listeners an overview, or I’ll call it an oversimplification actually of Agile marketing, just so that they are aware what we’re talking about. And this is an oversimplification, but yeah, take it as it’s meant. Some of the key concepts around Agile are really around using techniques and I guess processes to rapidly get marketing pieces in market. So it’s about speed, efficiency, and as we’ll look at in the report, it’s about quality as well. But there’s a few things, they’ll have clear queues or lists for tasks and they’re often in a priority order and everything gets added into that. And then the tasks are broken down into smaller chunks that can be finished quickly. This is this idea of a very quick iteration. Some people might’ve heard of this minimum viable product. It’s often a developer term around getting products to market quickly. Well that’s coming into play with marketing as well. And you aim to have each person working off a single queue. And so in teamwork for example, you use teamwork, don’t you Ian?

– Yes.

– Have you used the my work listing?

– No I haven’t.

– I mentioned that because according to HubSpot when I was chatting with Elliott recently, shout out to Elliot by the way. He was saying by far the majority of agencies and marketing teams that he comes in contact with use teamwork as their project management tool. So we use it as well. So maybe listeners are familiar with that. And so we use the my work listing cause it just gives you your work in a listing. You can set in priority order, we use true date, but it’s a nice way of having a single queue and often in Agile marketing they want this to be visualized so you can see it. We actually don’t do that. And the number of tasks that you’re working on tends to dictate how quickly work is done. So this kind of is obvious in hindsight, but if you’ve got a few tasks to do then you’ll do them quicker rather than having tons of tasks when you’re context switching all the time. And context switching is one of those things that they try to minimize. Although we’ve actually found that most of our context switching costs, this is where you switch between something and you get distracted, come from things like Slack and email and phone calls. It’s not necessarily switching between marketing tasks, that’s the problem.

– Correct.

– But then there’s also things like daily catch ups, I’ll refer to that as stand up. You might’ve heard that term. And then also review meetings if you might have heard the term retrospectives. So they’re some of the terms. I know you use this in your agency as well. How do you find that there’s an awareness of this whole Agile marketing approach when you’re chatting with clients and also your team and other agencies in?

– Craig I think for us, we’ve always been of the understanding that implementing quickly and getting it out and testing and measuring, which is what we talk about a lot is really key. So I think probably in the last six months to a year we’ve implemented with clients, a lot of them is like, let’s do a quick weekly meetings. Let’s check the results of the previous week. Let’s then see what we can do this week and measure the results. So we’ve kind of almost moved to this weekly model where we’re testing and iterating on new things to make things better. And by not letting things run for too long. Now there are obviously factors. If you don’t have enough traffic and you don’t have data, that’s not gonna work. So this relies on having a center traffic and data and analytics that you’ve got in place to make things happen. So being really clear and having that one thing has worked really well. I think this is also on my journey as a business owner is understanding I can’t do everything. So I’ve gotta focus on a few things. I just needed to do that one thing this week that gets me to my goal. And we’ve essentially just rolled that out across with clients as well and keeping it really simple. That’s really been the key.

– Yeah, I think that’s really good. And moving onto the report now, the main goal, it’s interesting what you said there, getting one key thing out and also quality. Based on the report, and by the way I will say this, the Agile shoppers reports based on 637 predominantly U.S. marketers who responded. So it’s a good sample, it’s not huge though, but the main goal of adopting Agile, I had in this kind of order was increasing productivity, increasing the speed of delivery and improving quality. And I think that’s what you highlighted there. But there’s also this ability to easily change priorities and also easily show what is worked on. We find this with clients who are delivering their stuff and they’re kind of like, whoa, where does this all fit in, the kind of scheme of things. And that’s where a tool like teamwork and those many other project management tools really make it easy to communicate that kind of thing. So well worth downloading that report. And I’ve put a little thing in the show notes where I’ve made a little comment about the form, one of the form fields I had. We won’t chat about it now cause I’ve probably gotta move on in terms of time but a little extra there for listeners if they wanna check out the show notes but well worth downloading the Agile marketing report.

– Craig, onto HubSpot marketing feature of the week. And we’re gonna look at the analyzer marketing emails section within HubSpot. Now you might have seen this, it has a little new beside it when you go in and I thought, oh let’s go check this out. So now analytics has moved around and things have changed. What I liked about this, we do a lot of email marketing for customer of ours that is in the medical space. Now, it was interesting when we first started doing it and they were using MailChimp to do it before we moved over to HubSpot. It was a bit erratic. And so most of the time we find send emails first thing in the morning works really well. People get up, first thing they do is get their phones, scroll their emails, have a look. Anyway, while we’re doing this, I’ve been testing out different times of delivery within HubSpot. One thing I wanted to highlight with this on this page with the analysis is that they have an email performance chart. And what that shows is your campaigns that was sent out to the little dots on the graph. It gives you your average, let’s say delivery or open rate, et cetera, and it plots the two. So one of the things I realized, and what we were doing was, I highlighted over each one of these to figure out, okay well who did it go to? What was the open rate? What was the click through rate? And then also tells you what time it got sent. And I saw all the ones with the higher click and open rate were actually after lunchtime. So now I’ve just been testing it different times during the lunch period. So I started with like around 12 o’clock and actually what’s funny is the one that’s done the best is the one that’s gone towards the end of lunch, which is probably like one o’clock 1:20 which you’ll see in that report. But that was to a different segment of the database. So it might just work because it happens to be the dealers that we’re getting that email. But I just thought it was really interesting because I could get asking the questions like, how do we make this open rate better? And I just went, oh, hang on, here’s all the data I can tell you in and because I actually have it. So I don’t encourage people to have a look at that within HubSpot to get some insight and don’t be afraid to test and measure.

– Two things, one that’s a really useful report and I like how you can see very quickly on one screen the difference between the different campaigns you’ve sent. And then two, I think in your case, really good open rate and really high click through rate as well. It’s really useful for people to test and measure. I think that’s right. Most people don’t even test and measure. Now I’m dubious around send times. I think we’ve covered this before and I know people do analysis where they’re like, they analyzed millions and millions and they find that, Tuesday afternoon is the best time. I really like how you test and measure, cause it’s very specific. It’s about the segmentation. And I think you’re really spot on there with working out and testing things within your segment cause it’ll be different. And that’s the problem with large numbers. People take these millions of sane reports and I think, Oh the average was Thursday afternoon or something. I’ve got to do that for all mine. No, you should test and measure. And this makes it really easy to see the results of that. So I quite like that.

– All right Craig, onto our HubSpot sales feature of the week. And this is about sharing tasks queues. So if people have been using tasks queues to do their daily calls, follow ups to-do’s, it’s been a great way to make it a sequence of events that takes you to the contact record and you can go through this in a seamless fashion or you can reschedule it. What they’ve done now. And so one of the things when I started doing this and creating tasks for people, I wanted to put this in a queue like this is your core queue for today. So I wanted to stick it in a queue and you could never do that. Anyway it’s here. Now you can actually put things, when you’re creating tasks out of workflows, you can stick them into a queue and can even happen in a sequence. You can stick into a particular queue. So that’s one thing. The second thing is that you have the ability to share the queue with other people. Now the caveat to this, and you’ll see a screenshot in the notes, is that you’ve gotta have sales professional and sales enterprise to be able to do this. Now if you click share on that queue and you wanna share that queue with somebody else, the people that don’t have licenses will be grayed out. And then people with licenses will be able to see that queue. But you know what? This is a great improvement.

– Do you remember when they were first rolling out? It wasn’t this particular one, but was when you were adding users to some and you could add anyone. I think there was a bug initially when there were, and you could add, well, they’ve locked that down now. You must have the prominent enterprises. Okay, that’s really cool. And these little touches that kind of make the difference, isn’t it? They’re just tweaking and improving things–

– Incremental change, Craig, incremental.

– Was that call Kaizen change, isn’t it?

– The Kaizen principle, 1% every day.

– We’re all with the words of the week.

– It’s been a long week, Craig. Anyway, what’s our house for extra of the week, Craig?

– Well, there’s so many, and I’ll just say watching the Hubspot product updates video on YouTube. We’ve got a link in the show notes to that. There’s so many to cover and weren’t even gonna cover a few. And so we’ll cover more like, things like property recycle bin, product properties, all of those, we’ll cover those in future episodes. Workflows on service data. I haven’t even checked that out yet.

– So in saying that with the new and updated pricing and inclusions of service data and sales data, it now includes basic automation. And remember we talked about why do we have automation in the sales part in a different view versus automation in the workflow? And then that is exactly why because that was this data feature that was being rolled out and they were obviously testing it to see how this will fit and how it’s being used. So definitely if you have bought sales and service data or you bought the growth suite post, I think third, maybe late April into early May, you will have those features. So go and check it out.

– But in terms of things that we are gonna kind of, I really like this increased security and permissions they’ve got, so two little things I’m kind of rolling into one under this one heading of security and permission. So the first is on properties. So contact properties, company products, et cetera. You can go into a property now and assign users and teams. I’ve got a screenshot in the show notes just about say a custom property we’ve added for HubsShots. You can assign users and teams and then I’ve got a screenshot of how you can assign them. So that’s actually quite useful because you might want some people to be the guardians of particular dropdown fields. You kind of let, well I don’t wanna point the finger too much at salespeople, but they kind of like, oh, we wanna add another thing to that. How did you find out about us, drop down? And before you know it becomes this huge long mess. And like marketers, the marketing things, who added these, why are they in there? Where you can lock all that kind of stuff down. So that’s a nice little touch. And then the second one is about account access to permission. So this is on the users specific permissions. I just highlight this under the account setting. You can say whether they can edit, edit users, et cetera. But one of the key things is there’s a thing for editing HubDB tables, and I wanted to call this out because it’s separate from the one that’s under marketing permissions. You may recall under marketing permissions, you can publish and write and read HubDB entry. So that’s a permission and we’ve normally given that to people. But now under the account access, you’ve actually got further permissions about whether they can unpublish, clone and configure the settings in the table and delete them. So just be aware of that. In case you’re thinking like, oh, I’m under marketing, I gave them permissions for this. But they can’t do certain things. That’s under the account permission. So potentially a little gotcha there but we haven’t put it in gotcha of the week cause it’s more of been, I really like this idea of bringing permissions and granularity to the way that we set up accounts for access. It’s getting complex yes, but necessarily so, and I still think that the permission model that HubSpot use and the way that you can easily take things on and off is still very intuitive compared to many other products where this stuff gets lost and totally confusing. I actually think the way HubSpot does it is still very simple compared to other tools.

– I agree Craig. And I think this is a real improvement because I know that as we deal with bigger businesses and we deal with teams that are spread all over the country and we deal with franchises, this is what comes up. It’s like I wanna be able to not let those people touch that field and it’s so good to see that it’s come into play. So well done. All right, onto our gotcha of the week Craig. And this is probably not really a gotcha, but a more of a usability issue. And so we were working with a customer. So in Australia, in the UK, we set our dates in day, month, year. Now in the U.S. it goes year, month, day. And so they were like, okay, cool. And then we created a form, I’m like, okay, because they were trying to select event dates. So they wanted people to be able to select, this is the date of my event. Now what happened was in the form when you choose the picker or you see it, it actually goes by year, month, day. So they’re like, can we change that? And I’m like, oh yeah, well I thought it should be. Anyway, I got into HubSpot support and a few people have complained about it and they said, look, what’s happening is it’s not reading the settings from HubSpot portal and therefore it’s displaying like that or there’s not enough time for that thing to happen. So they’re working on something to fix it so that it is better from a user perspective of if we’re expecting to see date in day, month, year as opposed to year, month, day. And that’s a pump hearing on our form.

– But isn’t the issue just the way that it’s formatted? So instead of like you’ve got a good example here in the show notes where you’ve got 2020-06-06 actually a better example would be if you had 2020-05-06. Is that the 5th of June or is it the 6th of May?

– Exactly!

– It’s hard to tell. But if you just change the format to say, 06 May, 2020, rather than having that format, wouldn’t that just solve it? So it’s the display format. You can still tell from the picker, but it’s by format?

– Correct, exactly. Anyway, they’re working on something. But just from a usability perspective, I thought I’d share that with people just in case they’re like, why does this not happen?

– I think that’s a very good example.

– Marketing tip of the week, Craig. And we’re gonna talk about B2B content marketing insights.

– I’ve had this one on my backlog. I’ve been wanting to chat about it on the show for a couple of episodes actually, but we keep pushing it back cause other stuff comes in. But this is a report from Convince & Convert. They’ve called it their B2B content marketing trends to watch in 2020 report. You know how I often bag out people and reports who are saying trends for starters and then also trends in 2020. It’s kind of click-baity. So that’s why I prefer the term insights. However, this is quite a good report. I think it’s useful, I quite like Convince & Convert. We’ve featured them on the show many times, but the report covers a ton of useful insights, but we’ll just pull a few out. And in particular that content marketers, B2B content marketers, they tend to be largely top of the funnel-focused, which kind of makes sense, but it’s also an opportunity I think, and maybe that’s aligned with goals. Marketing teams are often KPI’d on leads rather than conversions, which might be more bottom of the funnel pace. 84% is paid distribution. I’m sure that’s in an inbound way though, Ian. But interestingly most marketers, and perhaps this relates to the first term about top of the funnel bit. They have metrics for content performance, but very little for ROI measurements. And I hear this a lot and it’s really hard, if you’re doing content marketing and getting leads. Calculating ROI, especially if you don’t have the full loop visibility which often many marketers don’t and especially on very long sales cycle industries, which B2B can be, if it takes a year to convert someone. How do you work out ROI upfront in the first month on the campaign can be very hard. I thought that was a very useful insight and something I’m sure will be the focus of many marketers. We’ve got to get a much clearer picture on terms of financial ROI on leads. But then there was a good item that you notice from their blog posts that’s actually from 20, it’s covered in page 21 on the report. Do you wanna chat about that?

– Yeah and what that was, it says most B2B content has promotional aspects and the aim is to get people to take desirable actions. That often means doing business with a company or at least showing a willingness to learn about them. When added about their priorities though the vast majority, of the most successful marketers put their energies into fact checking and delivering highly informative content to their audiences.

– The vast majority of the most successful marketers put their energies into fact checking and quality. I think that’s a really useful insight.

– It’s one that really stood out, Craig, and that’s why I highlighted it to you. Because I think both you and me, we are both about checking stuff and delivering that high quality information to people that we’re serving. And we don’t want to just take things out of places that have no, let’s put it good foundation. So this is really encouraging to see that the people that are doing it well, are really keen on making sure that they get their facts right.

– Yeah, I would just highlight. I’m pretty sure most marketers don’t put their energies into fact checking, but most successful marketers do put their energies. And I think it’s really important and as we covered on the show, it might’ve been last week when we were chatting about Google’s focus, especially around COVID and crisis related content. It’s all around authority and quality and factfulness of the content. And that’s going to relate to all industries and especially people with purchase intent are very much interested in the quality or the reliability of what they’re rating from marketing. So use that insight well in your approach to content creation.

– Craig, onto the insight of the week.

– Can I chat about Shopify? eCommerce of course, has been–

– Such a boom industry.

– Rapidly focused on by many companies at the moment trynna move to online, especially even with training and other nonphysical products. As Shopify released this app, it’s called the shop app. Maybe you saw it, did you actually say this, Ian when it rolled out? I think it was last week.

– No.

– It’s actually an app. So Shopify have released an app called Shop. I’ll just explain what it does briefly and has two main functions. You can track orders. And admittedly this was, they had an app earlier, I think it was called Arrive and that was a tracking system, but they’ve rebranded it. But also you can follow brands. So you can go into the Shop app and you can do a search of all the different and it’ll surface every single Shopify app. And there’s millions of Shopify-powered stores globally. So you can follow your brands. So you could follow Allbirds, shoes or hands and belts or things like that. And it’ll have latest deals and a selection of things to promote to you. So I was looking at this, I was thinking, I thought this was really interesting and I can see this as just the tip of the iceberg for Shopify. Once they have a scale where they’ve got millions of shops, which they do now, and increasing, they have a chance to aggregate or be a layer on top, which highlights all of those brands. And of course they’re across many different industries and things like that so you can see where this is going. And I wouldn’t be surprised if they released another website. Maybe it’s gonna be called shop.com or maybe, I don’t know.

– I think shop.com is taken.

– In a domain shop this thing is probably a $50 million domain purchase if they wanted that. But they become in a sense a little bit of a mini-Amazon. Because they’re across the top of the brands and you’d dig into the shops on the flight. So I see it as a really good idea and I think it differentiates them from say WooCommerce and other tools, maybe BigCommerce have got similar plans. I’m not that familiar with what they’ve been doing lately. Anyway, I thought it was a very interesting insight and for marketers, I think we should be really thinking about this. I will say though, I love Stratechery by Ben Thompson and so I’m a subscriber and I read his content. He doesn’t like the idea. He was very unimpressed with it. So I thought I’d just put that in the show.

– Really?

– Yeah. And he’s thinking, which I totally understand I kind of agree with everything he says. I’m very nervous about speaking differently to him on this particular case. But he sees Shopify’s power as a platform. They have their Shopify delivery network, so their merchant service and so the power they do is they connect merchants seamlessly with all these other delivery partners and things like that. So that’s the power of Shopify. Again, something WooCommerce doesn’t do by the way. So he sees that as the power of Shopify, whereas being a layer on top, inserting themselves between consumers and merchants, he sees that as a bad move. And in fact he sees them kind of competing with merchants in a way to get attention from consumers. Now I can see that, but I’m not an expert in this, but when you look at Amazon, they’re all across the stack. They’re right across the top, but they’re also across their delivery frameworks then. So I’m more positive on it than he is. This is what I’ve been waiting for from Instagram. You know how we keep hearing about the Instagram eCommerce, is gonna be coming in and out and all this? Facebook has access to so many more providers than Shopify does. Sure, they’ve got a million or more sites, but that’s nothing compared to hundreds of millions of potential sellers. So I agree it’s smaller, but I really think Shopify is the future here. And so the takeaway and weren’t mentioning it in the show is because marketers are frantically, I use that word frantically looking for new avenues amidst the current crisis. And I kind of feel if you’re gonna be investing, marketing thought and attention into where your online outlet is, it’s gotta be Shopify as number one. I just can’t, unless you’re heavily invested in WooCommerce in terms of dev features or something else. I just can’t see how you would not use Shopify. Anyway just throwing that out there. What’s your thoughts, Ian?

– I think you’re on the right path, Craig. And one of the things I have seen recently because we’ve helped a lot of people set up stores and I guess all of us have been buying stuff online. One thing you realize is that once someone has a Shopify store and they’ve got that feature enabled where if they recognize that it’s already a Shopify customer, like I know when I buy stuff and I put my email, and it says, oh, I recognize who you are. Here’s the six digit SMS that’s coming your way. Pre fills all your details. And in two clicks you’re out of there. It’s almost like an Amazon experience or better. And I just think, wow, it’s just that one feature is amazing. And just the ability to set it up quickly and do things is something that we need to be aware of in terms of the speed to market. So again, we spoke about speed before. This is one of those places where speed is gonna become a really key attribute.

– That’s a really good point actually. I realized I didn’t qualify earlier. So you need to have Shopify payments, which is that functionality you’re talking about there. You need to have that enabled on your store. I don’t know why anyone wouldn’t have that enabled by the way, but you need to have that enabled for your brand to appear in the Shopify app. I think they might’ve limited it just to U.S. stores at the moment, but it’s rolling out globally. But that’s exactly right. It takes the friction out and that’s part of this app’s benefit as well and you can just be in the app and push from the app seamlessly.

– All right, Craig, onto a throwback of the week. And then guess what? There wasn’t much going on a year ago in HubSpot, so we had stuff very early in May and which we spoke about. There was a whole refresh of the campaigns tool, which we spoke about in the last episode. And there wasn’t anything towards till the end of early June. So and then it was really interesting. I went, oh well I’m gonna go to status.hubspot.com and see what was going on in terms of support or in terms of outage of systems and system performance. And again they redesigned that as well. And I haven’t put it in the show notes but there wasn’t much. I mean it’s just the usual you get, there was an interesting thing where I think there was internet service provision happening in Australia so people couldn’t access HubSpot at one particular time. I think some parts of analytics didn’t work or list and get updated. When we’re talking about a massive system, we expect a few things but nothing major. But so it was interesting. It has been a quiet period and maybe was it earnings calls time recently? Maybe a year ago? Maybe that’s why we had a bit of a quiet time.

– Could be.

– All right, results of the week, Craig. We’ve got some keyword research tools.

– Yeah, so just very quickly, cause I know we’ve gone over time, but scout suggest freaky wind research tool, check that out. Limited doesn’t include search volumes or anything like that. Competitiveness, but it doesn’t include a very good list based on Google autocomplete. And while we’re talking about keyword research, there’s a great guide from Moz. They also have their own keyword tool, which is very good. They’ve got a free and a paid offering as well. So details on that in the show notes.

– Now, Craig, you’ve got a quote of the week, from Kevin Kelly and I have no idea who Kevin Kelly is. So, I’ll read the quote it’s–

– Being enthusiastic is worth 25 IQ points. I love this, this is from a blog post that he wrote around 68 pieces of advice. He was turning 68. I think he’s one of the founding editors of Wired Magazine

– You’re right.

– And quite well known in terms of technology innovation and change over the years. And he had a post where he just shares all these pieces of advice, well worthy to read. And we’ve got a link from that in the show notes as well.

– Excellent. Now we’ve got lots of bonus links in the show. And listeners, thank you so much for listening to us. Please again connect with us on LinkedIn. And tell us that you listened to us, we’d love to hear from you. Thank you for everyone who has shared our 200th episode. We greatly appreciate that. You can listen to us on Spotify, on YouTube, on Apple Podcasts, and just share it with somebody, that will help them. And we do really appreciate you, again in this time when we’re all in isolation. I was slowly getting out of my isolation. I wanna just put an offer to everybody is to please don’t be afraid to contact Craig and myself and ask for help. If you need help, we will surely help you and if we can’t, we will surely pass you onto somebody that will and don’t be afraid to ask us. We will be more than happy to help you guys. Well Craig, until next week.

– Catch you later, Ian.

– [Narrator] Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news, including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at hubshots.com.

Episode 201 HubSpot CMS Hub Content Staging

Episode 201: HubSpot CMS Hub Content Staging

Welcome to HubShots Episode 201: HubSpot CMS Hub Content Staging

This episode we chat about the often overlooked HubSpot CMS Content Staging feature. Plus, how to prioritise your Chatflows.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/episode-201-hubspot-cms-hub-content-staging

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to the HubShots YouTube channel

Subscribe to the HubShots Spotify channel

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Connect with Ian Jacob on LinkedIn and Craig Bailey on LinkedIn

Recorded: Thursday 30 April 2020 | Published: Friday 08 May 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week


Thanks to Martin Bredl – a listener and great supporter of the show from Austria.

Also to Ryan Jones (runs an agency in Adelaide) who connected on LinkedIn. Loved his wishlist item that we could use smart content to personalise the show eg if already a connection on LinkedIn, then don’t include that in the show.

Podcast Innovation

Interesting to think this through because it highlights how podcasting is in many ways still in its infancy – there’s no way to personalise the podcast episode. Looking forward to innovation in this area in the coming years – imagine if you could integrate HubSpot with a podcasting platform and include/exclude segments of the show on the fly based on contact lists, locations, devices, etc

No doubt the advertising platforms are working on this.

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

HubSpot CMS Hub Content Staging

HubSpot’s post on how existing customers can start taking advantage of the new CMS Hub is a useful overview.

Each episode we’ll mention a key feature we like and use. Last episode we chatted about HubSpot Smart Content.

This episode we’re going to cover Content Staging. HubSpot has a good overview of Content Staging in the Knowledge Base site.

Many people aren’t even aware of Content Staging, because it is so hard to find.

There it is under the More tools dropdown.

BTW we think Content staging should have its own tab at the top of the page next to Blog (as well as being on the Marketing > Website menu.

hubspot content staging

What you can do with Content Staging:

  • Copy over a page
  • Make changes (content, template, style, layout, settings)
  • Preview and test on devices
  • Move to Staging Approval
  • Push Live
  • It also keeps a log of the publishing activity

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

How to prioritise which Chatflow shows on a page on your site

HubSpot Chatflows are cool, but sometimes confusing.

You can simply drag and drop the chatflows on the listing page into a priority order:

chatflow priority

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

Reminder about using HubSpot to display cookie messages

HubSpot’s KB article on how to customise your cookie tracking settings is a useful reminder for people on how easy it is to get cookie notifications in place.

HubSpot Ads Add-on Limits aren’t really a problem

If you get a message like this, then don’t be too alarmed:

hubspot ads addon message

You can still use the ads add-on for reporting, but you can’t use it for managing campaigns.

Which is fine for most larger companies, because they will be managing the campaigns directly on the ad platforms themselves.

And in some ways, this is a bonus, because it disables the ability to accidentally turn campaigns on and off – which as we’ve highlighted a number of times before is a gotcha for many people – they mistakenly think the enable/disable toggles impact the reporting totals when instead they are turning campaigns off!

So, why would you upgrade your Ads add-on? The main benefit is you can sync an additional 50 audiences.

Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Do Unsubscribed Contacts count towards your billable contact total?

Yes, and No.

If you import an opt-out list they don’t count – unless the contact was already in your CRM (in which case, they are just then marked as unsubscribed – but still count towards your total).

In that case you should delete the contact out – and then it won’t count towards your billable total.

However, there’s a gotcha with this… caused by tripping over into next contact tiers – once you have gone into another tier you can never reduce. For example, here’ our XEN portal – we have under 74,000 contacts currently, but because we had close to 81,000 previously, we will continue to be charged for 81,000 indefinitely…

A real gotcha!

hubspot contact billing

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

Google to make product listings on Google Free

Google is changing their shopping ads approach to allow free listings. It is rolling out in the US in April, and planned for global expansion by the end of the year.

Time to get a shop setup if you have the ability to sell and fulfil your product delivery.

The best way to take on Amazon!

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

The Danger of Disposable Campaigns

A useful reminder from Adam Downer (VIP listener and supporter of the show) on the dangers of short term disposable campaigns, and how they distract from putting in place longer-term evergreen campaigns.

A good analogy comparing cheap single-use plastic bottled water versus buying a decent water bottle and filling with your own filtered water.

Especially in the current crisis many companies are pushing ad-hoc, short term campaigns to market. Current times might call for some of this activity – but don’t get so distracted with short term reactive campaigns that you miss opportunities for proactive, longer term campaigns.

Shot 8: HubShots Throwback of the Week

Improvements to the Campaigns Tool with the new design refresh

Last year HubSpot released some changes to the campaigns tool.

Some of the big things we saw enter at that time were:

  • New & Influenced contacts (improved contact attribution)
  • Closed deals
  • Influenced revenue
  • Campaign influence over time (by contacts)

Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Search Engine Ranking Factors

Brian Dean (at Backlinko) has done it again, with a monster update to his search engine ranking factors post. He drills through 11.8M Google search results to gain insight into: what factors correlate with first page Google rankings.

Caveat: this is a correlation, and the sample size (whilst large) is tiny compared to the total results.

However, that aside he confirmed a few common findings, namely that backlink profile is a strong correlation. As is in-depth, high-quality content. Also, above-average time on site. Interestingly, other factors such as page loading speed had little correlation.

Speaking of Brian Dean, he also has an excellent guide to technical SEO.

And if you’re looking for a thorough overview of what the Google Search results look like in 2020, this guide from Advanced Web Ranking is very good. It includes both organic and sponsored results discussion.

Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“One of the hallmarks of the dangerously stupid is the consistent belief they’ve found great solutions that experts somehow missed.” – Craig Mazin on Twitter

See also Dunning-Kruger effect.

Shot 11: Bonus Links of the Week

A handy tool for checking website page speed is Wattspeed. Includes upto 60 pages being checked per month for free. Check it out.

wattspeed dashboard

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 201: HubSpot CMS Hub Content Staging

Full Transcript of HubShots Episode 201

– Hi everyone. Welcome to HubShots episode 201. In this episode we talk about HubSpot CMS content staging feature that is often overlooked, plus how to prioritize chat flows. You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one HubSpot-focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks and strategies for growing your sales and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you Craig?

– I’m really well, and you know how at the start of the show we normally ask people to connect with us on LinkedIn? And thank you to everyone who has been connecting with us. So a few shoutouts. First of all, wanted to shout out to Martin Bendall, actually, over in Austria. Thanks for your support, long-time listener and great comments on LinkedIn, thanks for that. And also, Ryan Jones. He runs an Adelaide HubSpot partner, platinum partner, so a local–

– He does. I think I’ve actually met him at Boston–

– Oh right.

– Couple of years ago.

– You had to go all the way to Boston to meet him. But he made a good point. He said, “Oh now that we’re connected on LinkedIn”, ’cause you know, we say connect with us, he said, “Oh, can you use smart content “to take that out of the show”, which I thought, you know, he was joking of course. But it’s a really good point, and it got me thinking around podcasts and just how, I guess, still primitive they are, right? There’s no personalization in podcasts. Not like if you were using smart content in HubSpot, you could have smart content on a page if they were already connected or they were already part of a list or something like that, you wouldn’t show them the content. But we are still just in early days of podcast land, and I’m looking forward to innovation in podcasting, where in the future, and I’m sure the ad platforms will be talking about this or thinking about it, but where based on preferences and things like that, we would just record the show normally, it’d be chopped up into segments, but then perhaps marked, and then people would listen to it and if they are already connected on LinkedIn, automatically they don’t hear that part of the show. Maybe if there’s an offer we have in the show, they don’t hear that ’cause they’ve already got it. So personalized podcasting. I mean it’s the advertisers’ dream, right? They’d only hear advertising for their particular interests all that kind of stuff. So early days, but looking forward to just seeing how quickly and rapidly podcasting evolves over the coming years.

– That’s right. And who knows what’ll turn up, Craig. It’s only a matter of time. All right, onto our HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week, Craig, and this about the HubSpot CMS content staging, which is very overlooked.

– It is. Do you use content staging?

– I do.

– I’m sure you do, all the time. We use it all the time, our clients use it. It’s such a good feature of HubSpot CMS, and I thought worth calling out in this show because so few people even know about it, and I wonder if that’s because it’s so hard to find.

– I mean we’ve got–

– It is.

– We’ve got a screenshot, this is actually from our own portal, and it’s really hard to find content staging. You wouldn’t know where to look for it, would you?

– No, it’s under the More Tools dropdown, Craig, when you’re in your, when you’re looking at website pages.

– I kinda feel they should add it right up the top tab, next to the blog, and that’s what we’ve got in the screenshot.

– I think it’s one of those tools where it does take a little bit of time to get used to it, so I know when we started using it a couple of years ago, it kind of took time to get used to it and understand how to utilize it, but once you get used to it and you know how to utilize it, it’s a fantastic feature just to get things done and not affect your live environment. So those of you who have been in software land would know that you would have production environment, staging, and then a development environment, and so this probably follows a very similar model in terms of how it’s structured and how you’re able to manage your website redesign or page redesign with HubSpot CMS and do it in a really seamless way.

– Well let’s just talk about the process, just so that listeners who maybe haven’t used it can understand just how easy it is to use. So once you find Content Staging, you’ve manage to find it, ’cause it’s hidden away, but you go into the staging area, you can very simply copy one of your pages. You can actually just push it to staging. I think it’s called stage.

– No I think it’s actually in the list, Craig. So everything appears in a list, and then you can select

– That’s right

– to stage the page.

– That’s right, yeah. You actually push it to a staging version. So the current one still stays live. So let’s say it’s your home page, and you go Stage, so it puts a copy in staging. You can make any changes you want in there. You can change templates, you can change layouts, all kinds of things, and it’s only in the staged piece. You can change styling, and then you can view it on that staged area, you can share links with your team or with the client, for example. They can come back and approve it, and then it gets moved along to a staging approval or proof, and then you push it live. And the other great thing about it is when you push it live it keeps an activity log of those activities happening from pushing to staging to live. So it’s really good, it’s seamless. It also takes care of things like if you have a new page and you push it over your current, let’s say you created a new home page and it was in staging, you pushed it back over live, takes care of any redirects that it might need or it replaces the URL. So it’s really nice. A great little tool, and in fact there’s almost no downside in just testing it. So if you’ve got HubSpot CMS Hub, go and have a look, find Content Staging, just try it. Push something to staging, or stage it, and have a go. You will be pleasantly surprised.

– All right, Craig, onto our HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week, and this is about prioritizing flows to show insights. So this came from a question that I had from one of our listeners, actually, who implemented chat flows, and first of all we implemented a site-wide chat flow, so a live chat. Some of you might be thinking what is a chat flow? Live chat could be one of them, it could be a bot, et cetera. So we’d done a site-wide chat, and then they had gone down and thought well I want specific messages or specific chats on these particular offer pages, right. And they said, “Oh, it’s not showing”. So, and I was like, oh, there’s a priority. So then, thank you Craig, I said, I spoke to Craig and then kinda said, “Craig, how do we do this?” He goes, “Oh it’s the priority of how you do it”, and you can literally just drag and drop the priorities. So basically put the ones that need to have priority in terms of the really specific chat flows at the top, and then put the generic ones at the bottom. And another interesting fact that it wasn’t working was the URLs that they had stuck in to show on the specific pages, did not match exactly because they were using the URL is this and they had missed out a part of the URL, and therefore it didn’t trigger. So just be aware of that because you can often think, oh maybe I’ll just leave out the https:// and just put www.mybusiness.com, and that won’t work, because it’s not exactly matching the URL. So just be aware of that if ever run into any problems that that may be the problem that you’re facing.

– Good advice there. And also worth mentioning that this whole drag and drop sorting, I mean we might be used to that in other tools, but in HubSpot you don’t see that very often. I can’t think of any other areas that actually have that.

– Especially to do with prioritization of an action, essentially. All right, onto our HubSpot Extra of the Week, Craig.

– We’ve got two extras, and first one is just a reminder about displaying cookie messages. Had this from a client, was saying, “Oh we need to display “those cookies messages”, which show that the site’s, we collect cookies and all of that, and I said, “Oh well, yeah, just turn on the HubSpot one”. “What, HubSpot has it?” Yep, all built in. So many little things for free. You get, well, free as in they’re included. No need to go for another tool for that. So just a reminder about that. But the second Extra of the Week is to do with the HubSpot Ads add-on, and you know how the add-on has a limit of 10,000 US I think for the free–

– Correct.

– Tier, if you don’t have them for the Ads add-on, but you’ve got the, actually what do they call it? If you haven’t got the Ads add-on? You’ve got the HubSpot Ads.

– Yep, actually it’s just ads.

– -I think it’s just HubSpot Ads.

– Yes correct.

– Not the Ads add-on. Kinda confusing in itself. But anyway, if you’ve just got the standard ads integration, you’ll get this message, and we’ve got a screenshot in the show notes, when it goes over $10,000. One little gotcha with that, I think the limit’s supposed to be 10,000 US, but even if you’ve got 10,000, say AUD, as we do in our case, it still triggers the message. I think that’s a bug, which they’ll fix, ’cause if they haven’t looked into currency, but that’s not the issue. The thing is, you get that message, and so we’ve had clients saying, “Oh we’re spending “more than 10,000. “Has it stopped, what’s broken, what’s going on? “Do we need to buy the Ads add-on?” And I’m like, “Well, hang on let’s have a look at this”. No, because where are you managing your ads? “Oh, we do that natively on LinkedIn and Facebook, “or use the platform.” “Oh okay, so what do you actually use “the HubSpot Ads page for?” “Oh, just reporting.” Oh, perfect, well, just ignore that warning ’cause it doesn’t matter. You can still do all the reporting, all the numbers still flow through, and in fact, in some ways it’s a bonus, because it disables the controls that turn stuff on and off, which as we’ve talked about before on the show, is a user interface fail in my opinion, because people think that just affects the reporting totals. In fact they’re turning off campaigns accidentally. And so it’s not a problem. It’s actually perhaps a good thing. So it raises the question, Ian, why would you actually buy the Ads add-on at all?

– Now why you would buy it is for the increased limits, Craig, which we don’t really care too much about, but it’s really for the main benefit of syncing audiences. So I think when you buy it, you get 50 additional audiences, and that is why we use it. And I think also the speed of sync is a lot faster. So on the free, or the included counts, I think it’s every hour, whereas I think when you pay for the Ads add-on, the sync happens almost instantaneously or within minutes. So that’s a really key aspect. But have a look. This changes all the time, and I would encourage people to have a look, and utilize connect your ad accounts in. I know there have been quite a few instances recently, I’ve looked into accounts and been helping people that have reached out to us and I’ve said, “Look, why don’t you put all the data in? “At least you have some idea of what’s going on”. So go and check your accounts and connect in your accounts so you can get a holistic view of what’s going on.

– Yeah, it’s a beautiful reporting thing tool. So it’s really useful. Facebook, LinkedIn, and Google Ads. I’m really looking forward to them adding in Bing ads and Twitter ads, I don’t know if that’s even on the roadmap, but if those two are added in–

– Or Pinterest ads, Craig.

– And Pinterest ads, yeah. Oh don’t get me started on TikTok ads. If they added those two in as well, this would be a perfect tool. So they’re the only two things that’s really missing.

– All right. Onto our HubSpot Gotcha of the Week, Craig. Do unsubscribed contacts count towards your billable contact total? Now I only brought this up because I’ve been working with one of our listeners, and they said, “Look, we wanna load data in, and we’ve got all of these “contacts that we can’t communicate with “in a marketing perspective. “And HubSpot have told us that it does not count “towards our contact total.” So I was like, okay, I’ve never heard of that one, but I’ll find out and so I did, and I guess it just depends how you ask this question, right onto the answer you get. So when I asked the question, they said, “No, yeah that’s right. “If they’re unsubscribed, they don’t get counted.” And I thought, oh, really interesting, and then I was telling you before we recorded this show, and you said, “Ah hang on, I don’t think that’s the case”. Anyway, so we went digging a little to find out what actually happens. So this is a bit of a yes and a no answer. Craig, I think you explained it best, so I’m gonna let you explain it to all our listeners.

– They don’t count when you import them into an opt-out list. However, if that contact, even if they’re in the opt-out list, is actually a contact in the CRM, they do count. So if you’ve got a contact and then they’re unsubscribed, but they’re still in the database, they haven’t been deleted, they’ve only been marked as unsubscribed, that counts towards your billable total. So the answer that your client was getting from HubSpot, is a bit disingenuous, because it’s only if they’ve imported them in an opt-out list, and not actually had them as contacts in the CRM. So the reason you would have opt-out lists is to make sure that you’re not sending out to people that you haven’t had permission to, or have previously unsubscribed from another system that you’re using. But, be aware of this gotcha. If they’re actually a contact, they’re still billable. And, here’s the double gotcha. Because HubSpot has this, I hesitate to use the word evil, but they have this rule that if you push into a new billable tier, so let’s say you go up a thousand contacts into the next tier of contacts, you can never come down. So in my case, I’ve got actually a screenshot from our own portal here.

– That’s right.

– At one time I had 81,000 contacts and that’s now set as my billing contact tier, even though I’ve deleted out I think it’s less than 74,000 now we’ve done a bit of hygiene, cleaned out couple of thousand contacts and of that, I’m still billed for 81,000, even though I have less than 74. So you’ve gotta be really careful with this. If you’re setting up your portal, if you, and here’s the gotcha, let’s say you thought, oh, I’ll just import all my contacts, and then I’ll import the unsubscribed list, because they’ll be unsubscribed they won’t be billable. No, you could really get yourself caught there. So we’ve got links in the show notes and screenshots. Just be mindful of that.

– That’s right, and not only have you been caught, I’ve been caught out with customers trying to help them keep their database clean and then them getting questions back from billing saying, “Hang on, I just thought we cleaned up “all these contacts, but I still got billed for them.” So just be aware of that kind of scenario.

– Yeah, I think this is really bad. I’m not sure why HubSpot does this. I don’t know of any other vendor. Mailchimp doesn’t, ActiveCampaign doesn’t, Campaign Monitor doesn’t, other tools I’ve used don’t. If they’re deleted out, you’re only charged for the contacts you have in. So it’s, yeah, it’s one of those gripes. As much as I love HubSpot, this one of the little things that rankles me.

– It’s causing friction, Craig. Friction, lots of friction. Anyway, onto our HubSpot Marketing Tip of the Week. Sorry, this is not a HubSpot Marketing Tip, this just a marketing tip, listeners, and if you have not heard already, Google are about to make product listings free on Google Search. So if you know prior to this happening, it was served through Google Ads and probably still will be served through Google Ads, and it was charged. There was, the bidding and so on was based, essentially how you would bid for search words and search keywords and for display ads. Now, what they’ve done is they’ve said, “Okay, well, we’re gonna take this away, it’s gonna be free”. So you need to still feed your products into the Google Merchant Center for this to work. It’s not automatically gonna appear. You need to make sure that you’ve set up the Merchant Center and what they’re actually doing, from what I can tell, is that Google are working with major providers like Shopify, WooCommerce, BigCommerce, to make that transition, and be to seamlessly feed products into the Merchant Center and onto the Google Search result page much better. So I know over time I have struggled with this, with customers, like, “Well how do I get that there?” or “I don’t want this particular product”, or even how they’ve set up their WooCommerce shop, for example. So I have a customer that sells pots, and they have a really beautifully aesthetic site. All the pots, even those available in different colors, all the pots on the first image are great. Guess what? Pot color gets fed into the Google product listing, gray pots, everything is a gray pot. So how do we change it to be a lifestyle shot? How do change it to be a different color pot? And this is some of the things that always turn up when we’re talking about product listing ads. And I remember, you know, as Google partners, going to Google and then people saying, like in the future, there will be people that just look after product feeds and charge people to do that as a service. And I thought to myself, wow, that’s interesting, because who would have thought that that day would turn up, and that’s exactly what’s gonna happen.

– I think you’re right. The Merchant Center is still a bit of a minefield and confusing, and XML files here and all that kind of stuff, and then something missing that’s a required field, it can be problematic. But I think you’re right. Actually, the links with Shopify and WooCommerce, I think will make it a lot easier, and this is what’s currently rolling out in the US. I think it’s gonna be end of year before it’s around, well, in Australia and other countries, but time to start thinking about that now, and at first when I read this I was like, “Oh why are they doing this?”, but then I was thinking about it, I was thinking this is a brilliant move by Google, because if you’ve seen the news reports from Etsy and Shopify and of course Amazon, online purchasing, e-commerce, is going through the roof. So I think Shopify is now, it’s up 300%, the number of transactions and people buying. Etsy, which is more of a artisanal kind of selling marketplace, also up similar amounts, up massively. So online is big, and Google’s thinking, well, why don’t we own all the information about this as well? How will we do that? Well, we’ll make it free. And so everyone with a store, especially if they’re on Shopify or WooCommerce, as you say, or BigCommerce, they will automatically have those results just feeding into Google, and Google is like, this monster, just sucking it all up, every product in the globe will go, well, the US at least, will go through Google, and it’ll be there. And I think this is a really smart, strategic move. I don’t know if they’ll need to it through Google Ads. In fact, I don’t think they would need to. They’d only need to do it through Merchant Center, but I bet they put some kind of thing in place that you must have a Google Ads account in order to enable it, even though it’s free, so that then can upsell you on other amazing ad services as well. We’ll see how hard they push that angle. But I think it’s really good, and anyone with an online store should take advantage of this, but just be aware, Google benefits mostly, I believe.

– All right, Craig, onto our Insight of the Week. And the danger of disposable campaigns. Tell us more.

– This is a great reminder. I was chatting with Adam Downer, hey Adam, great supporter and listener of the show, and he’s a really smart marketer, and we were chatting about various ideas, and he was talking about this idea of disposable campaigns. I don’t know if he came up with that idea, or that name, but he certainly explained it well to me, and it’s this idea of short-term thinking. And of course sometimes that’s appropriate, and especially in the current crisis, let’s quickly spin up a COVID response campaign and that kind of stuff. But he was mentioning, and we’ve seen this in our clients as well, and he was highlighting this idea that a lot of clients, that’s all they’re doing. They’re totally reactive, very short term, and in the longer term, they’re actually quite inefficient, wasteful, because you’re spending a lot of money and a lot of energy up front to get this short-term campaign in market, to kinda just stay relevant, and then it finishes, and also no one follows it up properly. So a disposable campaign is something that you put out there quickly but you don’t really follow up, and you’ve had all the expense of getting it in place, all the time, effort, and that, but then you get none of the benefit of it being an evergreen in-market, always-on campaign. Now of course, depending on circumstances, an always-on campaign might not be appropriate, evergreen things might not be appropriate, but don’t lose the mix, don’t lose the balance. And he had a great analogy. He said it’s like those single use plastic bottled water. It’s kinda like everyone is doing those single use plastic bottled water attitudes to their advertising campaigns. No one’s putting the money into a proper bottle that they fill their own filtered water, which of course is a lot cheaper, a lot more environmentally friendly, a lot more hygienic over time. I thought it was a good analogy, and a good reminder, ’cause at the moment, in some ways, the contrarian view is to go for evergreen campaigns, to be building bigger things, and rather than just the copycat campaign of getting something out in market. I mean, how many campaigns, we’ve got so many of our clients, so they’re like, “Oh we’ve gotta get a COVID response campaign in market”, or how to work from home campaign, “We’ve gotta get out there, how to do remote work”. I’m like, it’s really expensive of course to bid on those terms, but everyone’s doing them. How are you different? What unique perspective? And of course, we all fall into that, and in some cases, people will think, well me must say something about it, we can’t be silent. The flip side is, let’s make sure the mix is not too much focused on those disposable campaigns. Anyway, interesting thought. Thanks to Adam for reminding me of that. What’s your thoughts on that, Ian? Are you seeing that with your clients?

– To be honest, Craig, not a lot. We’ve changed messaging, we’ve changed some of the way we’re communicating things, but on the whole I haven’t seen that happen. So it is interesting, and I mean, the thing is, you and me see a lot of things come across our desks on a daily basis, and we observe what’s taking place in different market spaces, and you’re absolutely right. This is exactly what’s taking place and people are either spending a lot of money and throwing a lot of resource into one of them, into throwaway campaigns essentially, without thinking long term about how are they serving their market and their people. So totally agree, it’s a great Insight of the Week. Now onto our Throwback of the Week, Craig. What was HubSpot doing a year ago? And around this time last year, there was actually improvements to the campaigns tool, with a new fresh design which we’ve been talking about this incremental improvement, where they’ve been refreshing the tool with a new interface and giving, and I think campaigns was actually one of the last tools that got updated. And some of the big things we saw come out at that time that weren’t in the campaigns tool, was this feature which talked about new and influenced contacts, and improved contact attribution. Attributing closed deals to that campaign as well, influenced revenue, and campaign influence over time by contacts. And so they were just some of the key things I just pulled out. Just, you know what? I think we, again, take for granted how much progress takes place in 12 months, and when we look back and we go, oh hang on, was that tool really like that 12 months ago? So listeners, don’t ever be surprised. And I think this, one of the things I see often is that, for example, we’re using the new contact view, that’s in beta, right, and I was on to HubSpot Support yesterday, and I was demoing it to a, I was showing a customer, I said, “Oh I’ll just create “this contact for you and do this”, and as we clicked Save, you see this red message come up saying, “Contact view already exists” and then it kinda flashes up like it’s not gonna save it, then it saves it and creates the view, right. So I think there is this delay in the time that the save is happening that you get this error message, and no one had picked it up. So I told Support, I said, “Oh look, this is what happens”, and he goes, “Oh”, and so he tested it out and he goes, “Oh yeah, it does.” Anyway, I submitted some feedback, and that’s in beta, right. So there are some things that can be a bit buggy, but they’re not afraid to change and to try things out and to make it better and to get feedback, and that’s what I love about it, and I think as our listeners, I hope that you guys are actually open to change, open to trying new things, and open to learning a new way of doing things, because I know, for a fact, working across different industries, across different teams from sales to marketing to service, how sometimes I hear, it’s like “Why do they have to change this?”, “I really got used to that view”, “Now I gotta change the way I do things”, “Do they need to do this?”, “I just wanna stick “with this, don’t roll this out to me”. And I think to myself, we live in a world that’s rapidly changing, and if we do not adapt a mindset of I’m willing to learn or try something new and try it differently, it’s very easy to get left behind. Craig, Resource of the Week.

– All right, well just quickly, ’cause I know we’re coming up to time, but Brian Dean at Backlinko, he’s done it again, and this is an update to his search engine ranking factors. A bit of a monster post, but I’ll give you the highlights.

– Such a good pillar page, Craig.

– Such a good pillar page. He trawled through 11.8 million Google search results, and then he did some correlations. So that’s the caveat. Correlation, not causation necessarily, correlation. And also, that sample size, which is large, 11.8 million, is only a fraction of, of course, all the billions of results. So it’s not, well, I wouldn’t, yep, just be aware of that. Those things aside, what came up, the usual things, backlink profile is still a strong correlation. Good quality backlinks, i.e. other sites linking to your content, is the strongest factor. Also in depth, high quality content, and also above average time on site. These are the main factors that get you ranking well.

– And site speed, right?

– Interestingly, site page loading speed was not a factor, didn’t have correlation, which I thought was interesting. So that doesn’t mean you should, you should go, “Oh it’s fine if my site’s slow”, because as we know, people often don’t stick around, so that impacts the other thing, which is above average time on site might be affected by that. But look, it’s the same old findings we hear all the time. Great backlinks plus great content plus engagement. That’s what rankings are all about. Worth a read, however, and then also another link we’ve got here is to his blog post on technical SEO. So it’s getting stuff correct on your site. And we’ve also got a link from Advanced Web Ranking on what the search results look like. So three good resources there, mostly related to SEO and search, but we’ll keep you informed of what’s the current state of Google rankings.

– Craig, I just wanna say to our listeners, because I get this question, I’ve got this question quite a lot recently, is I want to do SEO, and I’d like to say like, we are providing all of these resources to you guys. Now if there’s one piece of advice I can give you, is make sure your site loads quickly, and also look at your content and your conversion points. That is a part of a lot of, in terms of SEO, is like invest in the content that is on your site to give people a better experience, even just organizing your content better. So been working with people to go, is it really obvious what the next step is? Do your CTAs stand out? Or, at the other post, you say “Call me on this number”, or “Fill out the form”, you know. Yes, that might be a call to action, but when people skim content on your site, they might miss all of that. So are you making it really obvious what the next step is? Are you clearly providing a pathway for people to go to the next thing? All of these things matter, and I think, when you’re talking about SEO, if you can fix all of these things first, and be aware of how people are traveling through your site, you could have a massive impact on your search optimization with little effort.

– By the way, speaking of site speed, we’ve got a tool in Shot 11, called What Speed free tool, it’ll check out 60 pages on your site per month. Check it out. But let’s finish with our Quote of the Week, Ian.

– Go on, Craig, I think you should share this quote. You found it.

– I loved this when I saw this on Twitter.

– And I have to say that I haven’t had a good laugh in a little while. After reading all of this, and watching the video.

– Here’s the quote. “One of the hallmarks of the dangerously stupid “is the consistent belief they’ve found great solutions “that experts somehow missed.” Now I’m not gonna say any more except check out the link on Twitter and what that points to, and yeah, have a little bit of a chuckle.

– Gee, we should share that link, Craig, shouldn’t we? So listeners, thank you for listening, and if you would like to, please leave us feedback on Apple Podcasts. Again, we would love you to connect with us and say hi. We love talking to you guys, and again, in this period where I know some people are doing it really tough, and some people are accelerating, I would like to say Craig and myself are here to help you guys. Do not feel that you have to be worthy or you’re not worthy or you’re not at a stage where you can ask for help. We will help you if we can, and if we can’t help you, we will pass you to the right people that can help you, and that’s all I wanna say is that, just reach out and ask, that’s all. You will be surprised what people will do to help you out. So listeners, on that note, we shall see you next week. See you Craig.

– Catch you later, Ian. Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes and the latest HubSpot news and tips, please visit us as hubshots.com.

Episode 200 How HubSpot, Marketing, Sales and Service has changed in the last 4 years

Episode 200: How HubSpot, Marketing, Sales and Service has changed in the last 4 years

Welcome to HubShots Episode 200: How HubSpot, Marketing, Sales and Service has changed in the last 4 years

This episode, our 200th, we reflect on how much has changed in the last 4 years, including HubSpot’s focus and positioning, as well as the larger sales and marketing ecosystem.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/200-how-hubspot-marketing-sales-and-service-has-changed-in-the-last-4-years

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

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Recorded: Thursday 23 April 2020 | Published: Friday 01 May 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Our 200th Episode

This is our 200th Episode! Time flies when you are having fun.

Our first episode was recorded on 06 October 2015 just after we had returned from Inbound 2015.

This episode we’re going to look back on some of the key milestones that HubSpot has released over the last 4 years, plus how marketing has and hasn’t changed during that time. (Just think about the move to mobile as an example of behaviour change.)

As Bill Gates has been quoted as saying: Most people overestimate what they can do in one year and underestimate what they can do in ten years.

Let’s see what HubSpot has achieved in 4 years – we’ll bet you underestimate what has changed. And imagine what they are going to achieve in the next 4 years!

Kylie encouragingly told me that:

“All the goods shows crack 200 episodes!  You’re in good company with:

  • The Big Bang Theory 279
  • Friends 236
  • The Office US 201

Shoutout to the people who inspired and encouraged us

Our producer Chris Mottram and his company Podcastily who has been with us right from the start

Mads Nielsen, Varun Bhandarkar, Ryan Bonnici, Nick Dzienny, Brent Claremont, Lucy Seed, Bertie Campo.

Justin Theng, Adam Downer, Charles McKay, Moby Siddique, Dann Weatherhead, Chris Higgins

George B Thomas and the HubCast

Luke Summerfield, Brian Halligan and Dharmesh Shah

Tara, Roselen, Edward, Marie and Kylie

HubSpot is a Platform Company

When Craig was at Inbound 2014 HubSpot announced their CRM product, and Craig remembers the hush that fell over the crowd when Brian Halligan announced in the keynote that ‘HubSpot is now a CRM company’.

Prior to that HubSpot had positioned themselves as a marketing software company.

In 2017 HubSpot announced their Conversations features.

In 2018 HubSpot announced their Service Hub product.

And over the past few years they have been ramping up their integration capabilities.

Cue to today and HubSpot is positioning themselves as a platform company.

It’s going to be fascinating to see how they evolve over the next four years, as they expand into other areas.

Their latest CMS Hub product positioning, and extended feature set has been a long time coming, but in some ways feels like they are just getting started on the web application side of things.

flywheel inbound method lifecycles

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

More on HubSpot CMS Hub

HubSpot’s post on how existing customers can start taking advantage of the new CMS Hub is a useful overview.

Each episode we’ll mention a key feature we like and use. Last episode we chatted about HubSpot Smart Content.

This episode we’re going to cover one way HubSpot CMS Hub is moving into the Enterprise space.

HubSpot Serverless Functions

HubSpot Serverless functions are a way to write Javascript functions in HubSpot to interact with both HubSpot objects (eg HubDb table or contact object) as well as other systems (eg writing out to an external platform.

Simple example – you can’t write to HubDb from HubL or via a Workflow. Instead you would use serverless functions and write via the HubDb API.

From Simple Limited to Simple Sophisticated

Compare this to where HubSpot COS was 4 years ago. A simple website builder that had limited functionality when compared to WordPress or other CMSs. Today HubSpot CMS Hub is sophisticated and extensible, yet still very simple to use.

HubSpot is now positioning CMS Hub for developers, IT Managers as well as marketers.

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

The HubSpot sales tool has grown from nothing (the CRM was announced at Inbound 2014) into a massive platform.

Yes…small steps from the Chrome plugin for Gmail called Sidekick to the introduction of CRM in 2014.  What small steps that make a massive difference!

HubSpot Conversations

Conversations has grown to incorporate Facebook and Chat tools.

HubSpot Sales Enterprise

Now with Quotes, payment options, customised layouts of fields, deal workflows, playbooks.

Sales team reporting and the management of workflow for sales from tasks to calls, quotes & products.

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

HubSpot Connectivity

HubSpot’s focus on connectivity has been clear in the last few years, including their revamped App Marketplace announcement and acquisition of Piesync last year.

Other Acquisitions

Motion AI and Kemvi that were added in 2017

How could we forget the very early bots, GrowthBot made by Dharmesh!  I remember it delivering cartoons every Friday for our enjoyment along with the ability to query some parts of HubSpot.

HubSpot also invested in Terminus, the ABM tool, in 2017.

Shot 5: HubSpot Skills of the Week

HubSpot Academy has changed massively over the past 4 years.

When we first started doing our certifications there were around 10  courses. Now there are hundreds of courses and within those courses there’s at least 16 certifications and 29 awards.

The really big thing is they range from marketing, sales & service including courses taught by people outside of HubSpot.

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

Look how much advertising management has changed over the years. In this post from Conversion XL, Amanda Evans outlines how AI has totally changed the way advertising campaigns are structured – from many highly granular campaigns a few years ago, to few broad campaigns now – in order to let ML and AI work out what converts the best.

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

Marketing is:

  • The right message
  • To the right people
  • In the right place
  • In the right format
  • At the right time

The first two parts are more strategic, the last 3 are more tactical.

marketing 101 overview

Shot 8: HubShots Throwback of the Week

In episode 001 of HubShots we spoke about Growth Driven Design. It was a key initiative of Luke Summerfield at the time (and still is). Luke, as many will know, has been busy lately with the release of HubSpot CMS Hub. Wonderful to see how far the CMS has come in the last 4+ years.

Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Google Algorithm Changes

Look at how much Google has changed its algorithms over the last 4 years in this timeline of Google Algorithm changes from Moz. Plus how different the search results listings look. And the move to mobile first.

Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“Most people overestimate what they can do in one year and underestimate what they can do in ten years.”

  • Bill Gates

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 200: How HubSpot, Marketing, Sales and Service has changed in the last 4 years

– Hi everyone, welcome to our 200th episode of HubShots. In this episode, we talk about HubSpot marketing, sales and service, and how it has changed in the last four years. You’re listening to to Asia-Pacific’s number one HubSpot-focused podcast where we discuss HubSpot’s tips, tricks, and strategies for growing your sales, marketing, and service results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. Happy anniversary, Craig.

– Wow, 200 episodes, who thought we’d make it?

– And who thought we’d be separated like this, Craig? I know. Time flies when you’re having fun. And you know, when we were looking back, preparing for the show, it’s our first episode we recorded was in October 2015. You and I, we’d just returned from Inbound 2015 and you had said, “Let’s do a podcast”, this was all your idea, and I’m forever thankful for how you prompted me to do that and pushed me to do it, and it’s been a lot of fun. And so I think this episode, we’re gonna look back on some of the milestones that HubSpot has released over the last four years, ’cause so much has changed. Also, we’ll look at marketing, what has and hasn’t changed. It’s interesting what has and what hasn’t in the time. So yeah, a lot of fun ahead in this episode.

– That’s right. This will slightly different to our usual, but I guess one thing we should tell people, we actually had a pretty amazing guest lined up but because of the predicament we’re in at this minute, we will still be having that guest on the show, just in probably another 10 or 15 episodes time. So be on the lookout for that. And, Craig, as Bill Gates has been quoted saying, most people overestimate what they can do in one year, and underestimate what they can do in 10 years.

– That’s right, well, let’s bring that 10 years down to four years, and let’s see what HubSpot has achieved in four years, and I’ll bet you most of our listeners will underestimate what they’ve achieved, or they’ll think, oh it’s taken much longer, and so with that in mind also, what are they going to achieve in the next four years. It’s just gonna be amazing. And, by the way, when I told the XEN team, I was saying, “Oh you know, we’re preparing “for episode 200 this week”, and Kylie, she said, “All the good shows crack 200 episodes”, and she might have, it’s very good company with the Big Bang Theory, they made it to 279.

– I love that show!

– Friends, they made it to 236.

– Yes.

– And The Office in the US made it to 201. Now not that we’re a TV show of course, but we’ll just take the credit, and thank you Kylie for pointing that out and encouraging us like that. And you know, we should do a few shoutouts, there’s been tons of people that have really encouraged and helped us out along the way, haven’t there?

– There has, and so let’s start with one of the first people we probably had interaction with at HubSpot, and that’s Mads Nielsen, and Varun.

– There’s a bunch of HubSpot people that have really supported us right from the start.

– That’s right.

– And Brian Bennici, I think he’s over at G2. Nick Zenni, of course, still looking after us.

– Nifty Nick.

– Nifty Nick.

– And Brent, Brent has taken off in HubSpot world and gone to Boston. So Brent, well done on you. And then we got Lucy, Lucy Seed.

– Yeah, and also Bernie Campo.

– That’s right.

– I thinks she’s with Shopify these days, but–

– That’s right.

– Yeah, she was great supporter. you know, I wanted to mention Chris Mottram, our producer.

– Yes.

– He’s been with us right from the start.

– He has.

– You found him. Yeah.

– And Chris started his journey with us, because I tested a few people to edit this podcast, and he was the one that got what we were about, showed interest, and has been a real supporter of us. So thank you Chris so much for supporting us over these last few years, and you know, I just hope that there is another four years of continuing to do this.

– Yes, thank you Chris. And Chris is a bit of a superstar these days, he’s working with a lot of the really big names in the podcasting world, and he still sticks with us. So we appreciate that, Chris. And for anyone else that’s looking for an excellent producer, Chris Mottram, highly recommended from us.

– Correct. Now we’ve also met lots of great people by doing this podcast, haven’t we Craig? And so we just to name a few of those people. Firstly, Justin Teng.

– Go the extra Justin, thanks for your support.

– And Adam Downer.

– We actually met up with him in Boston one time, wasn’t it?

– We did.

– Adam and Louisa, thanks for being supporters. Charles McKay, of course, down in Melbourne.

– Hey Charles. And then Moby. Moby, thanks for contacting us and now being one of our friends. And same with you, Dan, we met you at Inbound and that was great. And Chris.

– Chris over in the UK, Electric, thanks Chris for your support as well.

– And George B. Thomas from the Hubcast. Now, we’ve met each other a few times and so it’s great to see that he’s still rocking on.

– And the Hubcast really. So George, when he was cohost on the Hubcast, they were kind of an inspiration for us, we used to take a lot of our lead from George. So thanks for being such a great influence on us. And then from HubSpot as well–

– We’ve got Luke Summerfield and, we’ll go more into Luke a little bit later. But also thank you to Brian Halligan, who was our special guest on episode 100, and to Dharmesh Shah. So I think without Brian and Dharmesh, A, we wouldn’t be here, and B, we would not be using such a great product like it is today.

– That’s right, and I want to thank my team, Tara, Roselen, Edward, Marie and Kylie, because they do a lot of the work behind the scenes, especially Marie these days, getting it all live and getting it out there on social. We just have a chat and record. We do the easy part, Ian. They do all the hard work behind the scenes.

– So thank you to both our teams. We have appreciated you guys doing the journey with us. And thank you Craig.

– Thank you Ian.

– Now, listeners, we would usually have a Growth Thought of the Week, and we’re gonna call it the What Has Happened to HubSpot Thought of the Week, and how it’s grown. So when Craig, you went to Inbound first in 2014, and that’s when essentially HubSpot was a marketing SaaS company, so they had a marketing product.

– Yeah, that’s right. I went for three years, I think 2014, 2015, and I can’t remember it was before or after 2016, buy I remember in 2014, in the keynote, this is when the keynotes, where Brian and Dharmesh did the keynotes and it was product-focused, way back, and they were a lot smaller then. But I remember Brian giving a keynote and talking about the new CRM, the sales features, and then he said, and he revealed it really well, and he said, “And I can tell you, HubSpot is now “a CRM company”, and there was like this hush that fell over the audience, they all broke into applause and cheering. And it was quite a change, ’cause I’d just seen it as a marketing company, marketing software company, and there was like sales, well they’re getting into that, guess that could be useful. How little I knew at that time. But that was 2014. I mean that’s more than four years ago, six years ago, but it’s really shown how effectively HubSpot has pivoted, or not pivoted actually, expanded, and there’s been some other announcements that have come from then onwards, hasn’t there?

– That’s right. So that was a really pivotal point, and I think that stemmed out of HubSpot realizing, getting marketing right, but then having nowhere where people would consistently put their leads, and how to process up following them up, and I think there was a staggering statistic at the time, it was like 70-80% of businesses did not use a CRM to manage their data. So that’s where I think that stemmed from. So what happened in 2017, Craig?

– Well then they had their Conversations feature came out, and then the year after they released Service Hub, and then over the last few years they’ve been ramping up the integration capabilities, we’re gonna be chatting about that a little bit later, and then if you cue to today, HubSpot has changed from being a marketing software company to a platform company, and I think it’s been fascinating just to see that evolution. They’ve expanded into other areas, and we’ve included an image of their obligatory flywheel so that you can see it. And then of course, now we have the CMS Hub, which is a positioning change, but also some additional features, which is really extended. So you’ve got this whole marketing suite, sales suite, service suite, underpinned by a very strong and sophisticated web application suite as well. So it’s exciting time, and with that, it’s like well what’s next? I’m really looking forward to the next four years.

– And Craig, what is the HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week?

– All right, so moving on, I thought it was useful to let’s reflect back on where CMS Hub has come from, because it’s been actually around for a long time, if you think of, it was called the COS, or the–

– C-O-S yes.

– Content Optimization System or whatever they called it when I first started. And they’ve got a post on how useful the new CS Hub is, CMS Hub, and we chatted about smart content last week, but I actually wanted to chat this week about some of their enterprise features to highlight just how far it’s come. So I’m actually gonna talk about serverless functions, which if you’re a marketer, you can probably go to sleep when you hear this, but if you’re a developer, you’re like, oh wow, this is exciting news. And really what’s happened, to cut to the chase, HubSpot moved from oh this is a marketing tool with landing pages and a few website abilities, to not only for marketers, but it’s also for developers and IT managers. So they’re really broadening who their user is for these tools, and when you look at serverless functions, which I’ll just give you an example what that is in case you don’t know what it is. Actually, I’ll give you an example. If you think of the HubDB table, you’ve set up a little table in HubSpot, I think most people are aware of HubDB now, you can use HubL to pull data out of a HubDB table, but you can’t actually use it push data back in. You manually go in and update the table, or you can import from the spreadsheet. So that’s where functions come in, and what serverless functions are, they’re JavaScript functions, you can write them and put them in HubSpot and then you can interact with all your APIs, and not only the HubSpot APIs, like the HubDB API, but even a contact API, or external systems, third party systems that you might want to integrate with as well. So this is all sitting within the server in functions, so it’s not like you have to actually configure this from the front end. But this is a whole suite. It’s almost an infrastructure piece there underlying it. And why am I mentioning this? Well it’s not really of interest to marketers who would be our main audience, but it demonstrates just the sophistication that HubSpot has grown into. And if you compare that back to four or five years ago, when it was just the guys whipping up a landing page in kind of a clunky way, I have to say, it’s improved a lot lately with drag and drop and templates and now themes as well. But what a change that is to come from, I’m gonna call it from simple limited to simple sophisticated.

– I think you’ve summed it up really well, Craig. We’re only at the start of this journey with CMS Hub, and just like all the other products, like sales, service, you will see this evolve and you’ll see things get better, better integration, better access, and just so much of good usability there. So I think something to look out for in the years ahead. All right, now we’re gonna talk about our HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week, Craig, and when we started there were no sales tools.

– That’s right. And do you remember Sidekick?

– I did, I was one of those first users of Sidekick, and I remember talking to somebody in Boston, I think, actually sold me Sidekick. I signed up for it and then, had a conversation with somebody, but I was like, wow that was a long time ago.

– It was and it wasn’t, because 2014, it does seem like a long time ago, but if you compare that to how it’s grown and now it’s HubSpot Sales Enterprise, I mean think about what are some of your favorite features in HubSpot Sales Enterprise or Sales Pro these days, Ian?

– Look I love the fact that there’s automation. So the lead rotation, I love that feature, and the lead balancing. Love the ability to do quotes, get signatures, use products, it’s just, I think that’s just even changed how we give people estimates in our business or quotes, because it is easier to do now. You can have that all set up, you can quickly send it, you can track it, you can do stuff. Another feature I love is Documents, Templates and Snippets. They are really good to save time, and I think as the sales tools have grown up they have become really good ways to help people save time and get great results.

– I think that’s right. I’d add to that, you can get payments straight from quotes these days. Payment integration, deal work closed that you mentioned automation, playbooks, customizing layouts. It’s like this is a sophisticated tool, and it’s just happening so fast, and so, I know we’re kind of going on, we’re really drinking the Kool-Aid this week aren’t we, Ian, but it is just amazing to see how much it has improved over the years.

– So thank you to everyone who has helped build these products. It has made the lives, our lives, and the lives of our customers, so much better for it. So thank you. Now Craig, what’s the HubSpot Extra of the Week?

– Well let’s hark back to what we were chatting about earlier in HubSpot is a platform, and connectivity and integration. Hasn’t that changed remarkably over the last couple of years.

– Massive.

– And so we’re not just talking about, oh well you can integrate with Zapier, but if you look at their revamped app marketplace, acquisition of PieSync, and in fact there’s been a whole bunch of acquisitions, haven’t there?

– That’s right. So one of the ones that kind of excited me in 2017 was the acquisition of Motion AI and Kemvi, and so that was to do with artificial intelligence and they bought those businesses back in 2017, and lest we can forget, the very early days of bots, and we had GrowthBot, and it’s still actually in my Slack, GrowthBot, and I think that was made by Dharmesh, that was his little project. And I remember it delivering, it would ask me if I wanted the cartoon of the week, and I’d say, “Of course”, and every Friday I’d get a little chuckle to myself as we saw the latest cartoons sort of in marketing and sales. And also one thing it did was, it had the ability to query some parts of HubSpot, so you could ask it questions and it would tell you, give you the answers.

– You know what? I remember the little anecdote related to Dharmesh, because when we’d come back from that Inbound, I think we were both at that Inbound and they announced chatbot, or GrowthBot, and we did a show after, we should find it, I can’t remember, but I remember it on the show saying, “I just don’t get this chatbot thing, “I don’t think it’s gonna take off, what am I missing?”, and Dharmesh very generously came on and left us a comment, and explained how chatbots were gonna grow and all of that, and look, it’s been proved right, and the whole conversations piece, you know, they were early on, and so that’s what we look to these people for. And of course now, people would look back and go, “Oh well of course”, that’s just a part of everyday website, but back then, you gotta remember, this is just a few short years ago, it was new, or they were terrible, they had a terrible experience, and now it’s just part of the web fabric that we use every day.

– And what else do we have, Craig? We had HubSpot invest in Terminus, and this is an ABM tool, so Account-Based Marketing Tool back in 2017 as well.

– Yeah, I don’t know really how that’s gone, actually, I think that integration kind of died off, but the point of mentioning it is, they were investing in ABM tools back then, and still there’s a lot of corporates that are only just waking up to the whole ABM approach these days,

– That’s right.

– And so, and of course, we’ve talked about this probably 10 episodes ago about HubSpot rolling out their ABM functionality throughout their hubs. So yep, early on as well. So yeah, quite interesting just to see how focused they’ve been on in pulling in these technologies. AI, ABM, GrowthBots and making them part of what just started as a marketing software company.

– Oh and I think we should add, Craig, when we started there was no ads integrations, and now that is such a key aspect of our conversations and our daily usage of the tool, is the ads integrations.

– In an inboundy way, Ian.

– That’s right, Craig. In an inboundy way. And just think, how much of Facebook advertising we do, Google Ad advertising, LinkedIn, and just getting that data in and being able to show people what or where have originated from and all the interaction. That is phenomenal, and I think, never forget how good it is until you go somewhere else and you realize you don’t have that. All right, Craig, so now this is a really, so we’re gonna call this the HubSpot Skills of the Week, and we are going to talk about HubSpot Academy, how that has changed over the last four years. Now, when we started doing certifications there were around 10 courses, I think in the Academy. Now there are actually hundreds of courses, and there are at least 16 certifications and what they call 29 awards that you can have. And it has grown, it’s morphed. They’ve got more people that are contributing, even industry leaders doing some of that training, which we get access to. So it is one of those hidden gems within the platform that people have access to. I know when I talk to people, they say, “Oh, how do I know all of the stuff?” You know what? Where did we learn all of our stuff, Craig? It was in HubSpot Academy, and I actually tell a lot of people, “You can know as much as I do. “Just do the HubSpot Academy training, “get certified, use the tool, and you will be “streets ahead of anybody else”. So I think there are some really big things, and you know, like we’ve seen the way it’s been organized, and even the way people have changed the way they learn. So they’ve got lessons in there so you can really see how they’re trying to make it more adaptable to how people are learning today. So I was, for example, today, I had a call with a customer, and I said, “Really you should be “using the ABM features”, and they said, “Oh we’ve got to get our head around this”, and I said, “Oh look, here’s the training”, I just searched up on the Academy, and I said, “Look, here it is, it’s 19 minutes of videos, “how to get started with ABM”, and I just said, “Look, do that, get everybody on your team to do that “and then take the next step”. But just such a wealth and richness of resource within the platform.

– I totally agree. And you know when they talk about the hubs? Sales Hub, Marketing Hub, Service Hub, and now CMS Hub. Sure there’s those four hubs, but there’s almost like a learning hub which is a key, well, what’s the word, pillar, it’s kind of a foundational element, and it really is a differentiator I think in the market. And not only that, the way it’s kept up to date is what amazes me. I don’t know who is looking after it or how they manage it, but whenever there’s a new feature, and you go into the Academy or the Knowledge Base, it’s always up to date. You never find out of date stuff. I just don’t know how they do it. It’s incredible.

– I agree. So, I mean I do thank you, and I’ll tell you how good it is, is that when my wife started working with us, one of the things I did was get her to do the training, and she is a chartered accountant, right. So can you imagine chartered accountant trying to do HubSpot training? It didn’t go very well. But you know what? She learnt a few things, and what is really interesting, as she’s re-entered the workforce now and she’s doing other training, she keeps coming back and telling me how good HubSpot training was, because she has not experienced anything like it anywhere else. So, there you go.

– Yeah, and look, if you told me it was an expensive access to the HubSpot Academy, was a high-priced ticketed venture, I’d be like, yeah well that’s worth it. It’s free, that’s what I can’t believe.

– And you know what? One thing we did forget, and I just though about this which is not in our show notes, is HubSpot Support. You know what? I cannot speak more highly of HubSpot Support and how it’s gone from strength to strength over the years, as they’ve opened more offices, as the teams have grown. You know what? Honestly, from people who are looking at HubSpot to you and me who use it almost on a daily basis to get answers back, I wanna say thank you to those guys, thank you to the people that lead those teams, thank you to those who help us every day and help customers every day achieve what they need to achieve. You do it and you are always doing it really well, so thank you. All right, Craig, onto our Marketing Tip of the Week.

– All right, we’re actually gonna move away from HubSpot a bit and broader into the marketing in general, just again, to kinda see how marketing has changed, and your whole ecosystem. I’ll just stop at this point and say, and by the way listeners, this is where we’re gonna stop talking about how awesome HubSpot is. I know you’re probably thinking, what are these guys getting paid, but I would just say, the reason we keep doing this show is because every week it seems like we find something that we’re excited about and it keeps us motivated. So that’s why we’ve got to show 200 and time has flown by. But, yeah, our Marketing Tip of the Week, this was an excellent post from Conversion Excel, Amanda Evans looked at how AI has totally changed the way advertising campaigns are structured. Now, I don’t know if we’ll go into too much detail about the article itself, but the summary is, we’ve gone from a very structured, specific way of ordering and organizing advertising campaigns, to now it’s almost like just chuck everything in one account, and it’s not this bad, but, group it all together and let AI work it out, and in some ways, you set the outcome that you want for the campaign, and AI and machine learning works out how to best implement it over the course of a couple of weeks. I thought this was an excellent insight into just how significantly marketing has changed. We’re gonna look later at the Google algorithm history, but you would have noticed the same I’m sure, Ian, just in terms of the whole way that we approach advertising campaigns for clients now.

– Absolutely Craig, and I think if I am thinking back and we probably saw a massive change two years ago with this. I always laugh because my wife keeps telling me, she goes, “Why do you have to keep learning and doing things?” I felt like I was restarting all over again two years ago when it came to paid advertising from Google and Facebook. So you know what? I think this is the line in the sand, so to speak, and how things have changed, and how they continue to change. It’s still evolving, so yeah.

– It is, and the other thing, I guess, the most obvious thing I’ve mentioned that listeners would of course be thinking about, is the switch to mobile. So if you think of what we were advertising four years ago, it was probably desktop, probably wasn’t app-based, it was probably static images with a bit of text, where it’s now very mobile-focused, it’s video, it’s interactive, and it’s targeted by the actual platforms themselves. In some ways we don’t know who’s actually been targeted, the platforms do it for us.

– Now Craig, we’re going to have our Insight of the Week, and this is something that you’ve been talking to with your customers, and you’ve actually demonstrated really well. So listeners, if you get a chance, and Craig, make sure we share this on the socials, about what is marketing, Craig?

– Yeah, so I’m just gonna, I thought this was appropriate to do at episode 200 ’cause I’m sure we probably did this at episode one, and I don’t know where I first learnt this, maybe it was HubSpot training, maybe it was, I don’t know, but it’s not new. But it’s simply when we explain to clients what marketing is, if they’re not really familiar with the term, we say “Marketing is the right message “to the right people in the right place “in the right format at the right time”. So I’m sure many of the listeners have heard this before, it’s a pretty common way of, well it’s a Marketing 101, and we’ve got a little diagram that we share, because really, and if you think about the first two, the right message to the right people, that’s often very strategic, that’s where the strategy piece comes in, and then when you think about the right place, in the right format, and the right time, that’s often a lot more tactical. I mean the right place, it’s the channels it’s gonna be in. The right format might be oh is it video or a story, or text or an image. And the right time is around scheduling, whether it’s emails or whatever. And so I think it’s a good reminder, and if you just chat with people, when you’re talking about marketing or starting up a new campaign or thinking about a new product or what you’re going to market with, if you just put it in that framework, it makes things a lot more easy to follow and gets you out of the traps, ’cause people will quite often go, “Oh, should we be doing it on Instagram?” and they’re like, well hang on, that’s maybe the right place part of the equation. Let’s make sure we’ve got the other, the right message and the right people worked out first. So just a reminder for people, how about we do this in episode 400 as well? Remind them again. Often we try to over-complicate or we get too bogged down in the details. This is the high-level view.

– All right, Craig, onto our HubSpot Throwback, or should I have said HubShots Throwback of the Week?

– I switched it out on us, yep.

– I know, I saw that. And in this, we’re gonna talk about episode 001 of HubShots, and in this episode we spoke about growth-driven design. And it was actually a key initiative of Luke Summerfield, and we mentioned Luke at the start of this show, and this is why, because we spoke about this in episode 001, and Luke is still there and he actually hit us up this week, didn’t he, Craig?

– He did. I was looking back at episode one, and you know, there was a comment from Luke Summerfield.

– Correct.

– So right from our very first episode, he as there giving us encouragement in the comment, and yeah, four years, well, more than four and a half years later, he’s now kind of leading the whole HubSpot CMS go to market piece, and hasn’t it grown significantly, and as you said, yeah, he was pinging us on LinkedIn and again giving us some kind words, which are very nice, thank you, Luke. In fact I was in a little Zoom call with Luke this morning, the product team, talking about HubSpot CMS, and it’s still going strong. So yeah, from episode one to even today as we record there’s Luke Summerfield being a great supporter, and thank you for that.

– Yes, thank you Luke, and we’re looking forward to more goodness from HubSpot CMS. Right Craig, now here’s something really significant that’s changed, and this is our Resource of the Week, and this is the Google algorithm changes, and wow, in the last four and a half years, how we’ve experienced change on search from the results we get to where we are and even if I think about people ask me about SEO, I’m like, man that landscape has changed a lot, hasn’t it?

– Sure has, and I thought this was a nice way to finish out the show, because Google of course has been around for so long, and look, if you want any other indicator of how significantly marketing has changed, just look at how much Google has prompted us to innovate. And here at least, we just see the last couple of years of the Google algorithm changes, how they’ve changed, but it’s not only the algorithm, it’s the layout, it’s the mobile first approach lately, so I think that’s a good bookend to the show in terms of how things have changed.

– And Craig, we can’t finish without a Quote of the Week, can we? And this quote for episode 200 is from Bill Gates, and it says, “Most people overestimate what they can do “in one year, and underestimate what they can do “in 10 years.” Listeners, thank you for listening to us and joining us on this journey from episode 001 to now 200. We just want to say thank you. We hope you enjoyed this episode, and as we do the next 200, there’ll be many more things coming and we will be just like HubSpot, becoming a platform. I’m sure we’ll be changing things and bringing new things to you. And we’ve started doing video in this period, so have a look on YouTube, and you will see some of the videos of us going through this episode. Well Craig, any last words?

– I just want to thank you, Ian, for your constant smiling face and wise words, and keeping me motivated with this podcast. Couldn’t have done it without you. Really appreciated all your help over the years. I’m looking forward to many more.

– Thank you Craig, same goes for you. It’s been, and listeners, I think we’ve spoken about this before. We have, from being, I guess, strangers at the start, to now being I think, in my circle, you’re one of the people I talk to almost on a daily basis, about work, life, and all things HubSpot. So, so I just thank you and you know, thank you for being the person that you are, and being a good sounding board, a steady friend, and an all round good guy. I think that’s the bottom line at the end of the day, isn’t it?

– Thanks Ian.

– All right listeners, we hope you have a great week, and we look forward to doing many more episodes with you. Please share this episode, leave a comment, connect with us on LinkedIn, we’d love to hear from you. And if you need help, like we’ve said before, please feel free to reach out to us, and we will help you wherever we can. Well Craig, until next time.

– Catch you later, Ian.

– Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news, including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at hubshots.com.