Episode 185

Episode 185: HubSpot Popup Form targeting gets awesomer

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about the new targeting features in popup forms, plus we remember Lil BUB.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/185-hubspot-popup-form-targeting-gets-awesomer/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

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Recorded: Tuesday 05 December 2019 | Published: Friday 10 January 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Remembering Lil BUB – the world’s most magical cat


Sadly Lil BUB passed away this week



lilbub 1

There’s a farewell video here:


We first mentioned Lil BUB back in episode 51 in 2016:


We’ll miss you Lil BUB – thank you for all the good you did in the world, including raising more than $700K for animals in need.

Even the New York Times gave her an obit:


It’s been a sad year:

Boo, the world’s cutest dog died in January, aged 12

Grumpy Cat died in May, aged 7

Lil Bub dies in December, aged 8

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

HubSpot December updates (but I think they meant November):


From which we learned about the following most awesome of updates:

Behavioural targeting on Popup Forms

New option in Popup Form targeting:


hubspot popup forms targeting 1

Very powerful – and means you can improve the visitor experience by only showing relevant popups.

hubspot popup forms targeting

Some examples:

  • Build a ‘funnel’ of popups on pages
  • Show TOFU popup to visitors, and then hide when they’ve filled it out
  • Show MOFU popup to people have filled out the TOFU popup, etc
  • Target based on SEO topics (links to the SEO tool)
  • Target based on number of sessions eg repeat visitors might see a special offer, or stop displaying forms to people who are regular visitors

For all the options you need Marketing Pro or Enterprise. But Starter still includes the Segmented Lists option.

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Comments on notes, calls and meetings in CRM

hubspot comments

Priority on Tasks

hubspot task priorities

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

Using Lists to Fix Workflow issues


Looking ahead to 2020

Looking forward to better attribution reporting, that incorporates offline and non-online activities

Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

A re-gotcha reminder about the Ads Add-on.

Ticking those boxes TURNS OFF campaigns

They DO NOT change the reporting summary at the top

hubspot ads addoon gotcha

Shot 6: Marketing Tip of the Week

An interesting title – The Best Time to Send an Email (Research-Backed)!


In general, the highest click-to-open rates are 10 AM, at 21%, 1 PM, at 22.5%, and have seen a spike at near 6 PM. The data reflects when most audiences begin or conclude their day and have the most time to check their emails.

Our question, these numbers are from GetResponse, an email marketing tool that combed its data to compile a report of email marketing benchmarks. They analyzed 4 billion emails from 1,000 active senders.  Why did HubSpot not use the data from their own email marketing system?

Shot 7: Insight of the Week

Is advertising the new dot com bubble


An interesting article on the need to test whether advertising is actually working for you.

General action item: Test and Measure, but test the right things:


Shot 8: HubSpot Throwback of the Week

Here’s what HubSpot was announcing 12 months ago:



Shot 9: Resource of the Week

Domino Chain Reaction


Shot 10: Quote of the Week

“We should be building great things that don’t exist.” – Larry Page

Shot 11: Bonus Links of the Week



Using Goals in Custom Reports


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.
Episode 185: HubSpot Popup Form targeting gets awesomer

– Hi everyone, welcome to “HubShots” episode 185. In this episode we chat about the new targeting features in popup forms that we love. Plus we rib a little bub. You’re listening to Asia-Pacific’s number one HubSpot focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks and features, and strategies for growing your sales and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you, Craig?

– Well, I’m good and I’m sad.

– I know.

– So I’m really happy about what we’re gonna talk about in HubSpot popup forms in a minute, but I’m also really sad, and this is nothing to do with marketing or HubSpot. As you know, I basically am a sucker for the cute little cats and puppies on Instagram.

– You are.

– And so we’ve talked about Lil BUB, who’s this, well, was this such a cute little cat. We actually chatted about it on the show, way back, a couple years ago.

– We have, you introduced me to Lil BUB.

– To Lil BUB and I’ve been following her on Instagram. Anyway, she passed away on Sunday morning, and I’m really sad about this, and that’s kinda weird. I’m a grown man, and I’m sad about some little cute cat on the other side of the world that I’ve never met but have kind of got to know through Instagram. So it’s been a sad week–

– And it’s been a sad year, you know, because Boo, the world’s,

– You’ve lost a few.

– Well, the world’s cutest dog, it was just an adorable Pomeranian.

– Yes.

– He passed away in January, and Grumpy Cat of course passed away in May. And Now Lil BUB has passed away in December. It’s been a tough year, so. Lots to be thankful for though, because Lil BUB contributed, and like the impact that she had on the world. She raised more than $700,000 for animals in special needs and things like that. It’s just been amazing.

– Which you think is pretty phenomenal for Lil BUB. But I’m just amazed, like, there not be many people on this planet that would raise that much money to help others so, yeah look, that figure surprised me. So, you know what this highlights to me, Craig, is the impact you can have no matter how big or small. Everybody has the ability to have an impact. And we’ve got the tools in front of us, right? It’s how we choose to use it, and Lil BUB and her owner used the tools that they had. Even what sometimes I would think would seem like a very dire situation. When you look at her and you think, “My goodness, how could this happen, or how could this be?” She used what she had and her owner, smart guy, used what he had to spread the message and make a difference to other animals. So, you know, we have a lot to learn from that. So, Lil BUB, rest in peace, I say. All right Craig, on to happier things, talk to us about marketing feature of the week.

– The only thing that I don’t like is when they changed the name laid forms to pop-up forms, which of course is a much better name, we all know that now, but laid forms, we always use to say, “What’s the secret, “what’s the best marketing interest, “get laid forms going, just get pop-up forms.”

– Well, it still is today

– It still is today. It’s pop-up forms, all the way. And the reason I didn’t like the name changed to pop-up forms is because I had pop-ups so I never used the pop-up in pop-up forms, I always used the slide ins.

– Yes, great.

– And I never used exit intent and I know study after study says that they convert so well and things like that but I just hate them myself so I don’t wanna inflict them on others but slide ins I quite like. And so, whenever I talk about pop-up forms I’m only thinking of slide ins, but what we’re gonna chat about applies to all forms of the pop-up forms. But this is extra targeting, and this is so good.

– You know what blew me away? The specificity of the targeting.

– Well, let’s explain what it is. So, previously you could target it’s gonna appear on this page but not this page. You could do it on URL’s, and I think Perimeters and a few other things but now, you can do it on, well, lists, segmented lists. So, I’ll give you the most obvious example. You show up form for an able or sign up offer, content offer. If they fill out the form, stop showing them the pop-up. Right, ’cause there’s nothing more inefficient than going back and having the same offer shown to you over and over again when you filled it out. And that’s a bad user experience, so this extra set of targeting, which you’re gonna go through some of the more complex ones that can be implemented but even the simplest one, segmented lists actually gives you a lot of power. And in fact, you can start creating funnels, really. You can have a top of the funnel offer–

– Exactly.

– And if they fill out that form, oh don’t show that pop-up and in fact, if they have filled it out, show this next pop-up, which is the middle of the funnel. Ah, you know the funnels dead, by the way.

– It is, Craig.

– So, whatever the funnels– anyway you can just have funnels of pop-up offers and it’s gonna be such a better user experience and what are some of the other targeting options you’re looking at?

– Okay, so look, let’s say in starter and possibly free you will get two options, which is to do it by a segmented list, or visitor, if the visitor is a contact or is unknown, okay. Now, when you go beyond that. So, you got to have marketing professional enterprise, here are the things that you can segment, or you can behave, you can segment by diverse type. Browse a language, country, so they click a particular CTA, day since they last visited, have they viewed a particular form, what their session count is, pages visited, referral URL, SEO topic, and SEO topic history. Like, wow, anyway so those are all the options. But, let’s talk about what you might want to do.

– You know, one of the key things could be the number of sessions they’ve had, so how many times have they come back? So you might actually figure out that you might figure out based on the number of times they come back if a particular offer hasn’t worked, you could actually now give them another offer based on their number of visits.

– Didn’t I have form views as well?

– Yes, correct.

– If you show a form a certain number of times and they still haven’t converted, turn that one off.

– You know the one I was thinking on session, number session counts, I would reward my loyal visitors. I’d almost like say, “If you visit my site, “more than a 100 times, I will not show you any pop-ups, “I will not show you any forms, “I will respect that you are a loyal reader “and I’ll not try to, you know, put you in the form.” Things like that I think would be good. But also, equally, you could say well, “If you visit more than a 100 times you’re very loyal, “I’m gonna give you a special offer that only you get.” For my loyal viewers and things like that.

– Yeah, just phenomenal.

– There’s so much flexibility here. I am real excited about this. I think this is, not only is it gonna increase conversion rates for people that use it well. But it’s actually just gonna make it a better user experience. Because, I’ll give you the most common one whenever I go to the HubSpot blog, exit intent, sign up for the blog. I mean, I’ve signed up for it, why do you keep showing me, so hopefully–

– Stop that from happening.

– Yeah, hopefully they have implemented on their own blog, I’m sure they will. But, I was thinking you know what the only thing that’s missing really in HubSpot in terms of pop-ups, we’ve chatted about this before. I would like an option to do a pop-up form that’s not a form, it’s almost like a pop-up CTA. I’d like to slide CTAs in the don’t necessarily have a form but they could just be a banner that highlights something with maybe a link. Click through to view something. Something interesting because I just love the slide in and the other thing I’d like is the slide in an option to hide it again automatically after 30 seconds or a certain time, it’s kind of like, yep show it. They haven’t responded–

– Haven’t done anything.

– Just slide it out of the way, yeah. So, it’s getting very, very–

– Sophisticated

– sophisticated. So, I’m really excited about it, this is the feature of the week. And I’ve already shared this, I shared with our team straight on just like, team, get on to this. ‘Cause this idea of just removing that aggravation for people we’re rolling this out to all our clients this’ll be just almost in the checklist for every site. This’ll just be it.

– I think you get some major quick wins out of this, Craig. If you actually have a strategy on how to use the forms effectively based on what people are doing and where they’re at.

– Thank you HubSpot.

– All right, Craig under has put sales pitch of the week. Now you can put comments on notes, calls, and meetings in CRM. So, I think this is really cool it’s the little things that add up to big things over time and it’s almost like we should have an episode called, ‘Increments’ with incremental changes. This is another one, so we are finding in our team that we are tending to put more stuff in HubSpot and between the team just tagging each other to note it especially around deals but also, did I mention to you how Carly is using deals. Talk to me about this normally, you know, ideal stage, what do you call it, pipe line stages.

– Yes.

– They finish it either closed won or closed lost.

– Yes, yep.

– She’s added some stages at the end after they’ve won there’s like a stage that is now have access to the site and invoice has been page it’s around like account management. So she has some extra steps now that count as actually close won stages, so there’s multiple. But she’s actually using her board view to go right, we’ve got his client, the deal was won, but now we know they’ve been invoiced and that we have access to their site so then, ’cause she account managing, she you know, right, then the project can start so that, she’s managed that from HubSpot. I’m like, “Wow, that’s really cool.” And so, you can see why commenting and tagging is that’s a natural for it, by the way, I’d love to see surely we have some others thinking of this in the future, where deals will naturally extend to a project.

– Yes.

– It’s almost that’s the next step in a way to track it. It’s the most ideal extensions. So anyway, I’ve totally gone off track but that’s a good use case where we’re finding this tagging and commenting on things is really useful.

– Right, so there we go. We’ve got that, and we’ve got another one where they’ve got priority on task now. And when you look in the priority queue it’s either no priority or high priority, Craig. There’s nothing in between, which is rather interesting. It’s a interesting design decision, do you reckon they initially had high, medium, low. And then someone said, “That’s too confusing, “it’s just high, or it’s not high.” I think that’s probably a good call with that, if that’s the case.

– Seems like an odd call, but it’s a good one. All right, HubSpot extra of the week. Craig, using lists to fix work flow issues.

– We might expand on this in a future episode but I think it’s a god blog post on the HubSpot blog just highlighting a few, first thing the issues that sometimes happen in work flows, people go into work flows, they don’t receive e-mails. They go into work flows, ah they get pushed out. You can use lists to kinda just report across that and what’s happened, and things like that. So check out that blog posts for a few examples and again, a reminder of just how awesome work flows are yet also, the power can be complex and so sometimes–

– That’s right.

– Digging into what’s gone wrong or expected can be complex but lists are part of the solution.

– That’s right, I’ve had one of those this week, which I got to the bottom of, it took me me a little bit of time.

– Ah, and how did you get to the bottom of it?

– Looking at the word for history and actually it was a timing issue because people entering a work flow and being held in a delay while another work for execute.

– Were these nested work flows, were they–

– No, they weren’t nested, so. It was an interesting scenario, so I had to track it back. And it’s all because of a sequence of events the user took that I didn’t think would happen.

– Why can’t the users just do what we want? Just go down the straight path of no deviations, right?

– But you know what, that was good. Taught us something else. All right, Craig onto the what gotcha of the week. And this is to do with ads, add-on within HubSpot.

– Yeah, so this is a reminder, this has been a gotcha of the week before.

– It has.

– I can’t remember it might have been 20 episodes ago, but when using ads add-on and you go and you look at your campaigns in your running so I had this yesterday with a client, its happened again. So when you’re looking at all the campaigns that are running you kinda see across the top a summary and almost and then you see a list of campaigns. What I’m finding, and I think this is intuitive, this is what you expect, is people click that tick box that’s that slider that tick it on or off, expecting that to be reflected in the totals above. So, all those campaigns, oh no, no, no, I’ll just hide that one from the reporting list. So they tick it off and quite often all you’re showing is the active campaigns.

– Correct.

– So your viewers only filtered on active figure, oh yeah turn that one off and it disappears out of view, and you go, “Oh, hang on, numbers didn’t update, “oh, that’s weird, anyway go on your merry way.” No, that tick box–

– You just turned off your campaign.

– It’s turned off the campaign. I think it’s a really bad UI–

– Yes.

– Choice.

– Correct.

– Because people are shocked when I go, “No, you’ve”–

– And it’s not clearly marked.

– It’s not clear, and you go, “All right, you’ve turned off the campaign, I had no idea.” Because then you don’t see the campaign, it doesn’t even stick around to show that it’s turned off, because by default as I’ve said you’re filtering just on active campaign, it’s like, wow, that’s a gotcha, so then people are going, “Hang on, there’s campaigns, “I never turned this on.”

– Well, you know what was interesting I had a customer today tell me their filter view was everything that was active and what’s the other status?

– Where you can be paused, or you can be in draft.

– Yeah, it must have been paused, right? So that I had– that’s right, they were paused because I paused it because the issue with some of the tracking that someone had done. Anyway, they said, “Ah, look I can see this issue here, “can I just delete this out of here?” I’m like, “No, you can’t delete anything.” I said, “But change the status at the top “to only see what’s active and “you’ll just see what’s running.” And they’re like, “Ah, yeah, okay that’s so much better.” So, you know, I can just see confusion on here. Like when people go, “I don’t wanna see that.” And they think, oh yeah, I’ll just push that, I’ll just toggle that switch, and away we go.

– I actually think they’re gonna have, because they’re increasingly putting more ad management features into the ads add-on, you know, I think that relates fun for LinkedIn lead ads that you can create from HubSpot now. And I’m like, well HubSpot must have the telemetry that says people are using it for that. But, we tell all our clients don’t use the ads add-on for managing and creating ads, only do it for reporting. Because most of our clients are being corporate, so we’re like, no, do that on the actual platforms themselves but then just use HubSpot because the reporting. When that’s their mindset, it’s like, wow, and they’re only doing it for point, that’s when the interface gets in the way, it’s like, ah, if it’s just for reporting. So, it’s hard, I think HubSpots gotta do some more work on these interface to be really clear about what’s management versus just reporting.

– Yeah, that’s right, because when you think about what we have in Google, for example, and we’re having Facebook, like it’s really clear, like, it looks like a pause button and it looks like a green, like there is nothing where this just looks like I’m toggling something on and off which could be, I’m trying to get this out of my view. And that’s how it happens. Here’s a little second gotcha. I had a customer as we were doing setup, I said, “Oh, why don’t you just connect your Facebook “account in with, into HubSpot.” So they did that, anyway I proceeded to create, after I left their office, I proceeded to create a lead ad and I couldn’t, it was grayed out. So, the person that connects the Facebook ad account is the only person that can create a Facebook lead ad from within HubSpot, did you know that?

– I didn’t know that, however, I’ve run into issues with lead ads before because I don’t know if it’s still with us, but you couldn’t share them even on the Facebook platform. So you’d create it, actually now I’m thinking of LinkedIn. You’d create it but then anyone else that had access to the ad account they couldn’t And I’m like, what are lead forms. And the other problem I guess with Facebook, I don’t know if they’ve overcome this yet, you can’t edit your existing lead forms.

– That’s right, you can’t do that.

– And I can understand why they do it. ‘Cause maybe changing fields effects a whole bunch of things and the measurement and stuff like that. But they’re very rigid, so I suspect that something like that that flows through to permissions as well.

– Yeah, I suspect that like it’s obviously very fine a user that’s connected the account so like, for example, if I’ve connect in then I ask you to create the lead ad, you won’t be able to. It’s just grayed out.

– I’m gonna guess that that’s a Facebook limitation, not a HubSpot limitation.

– Marketing tip of the week, Craig. And this is a blog post from HubSpot. And what caught my attention was I had people ask me this week, “What’s a good time to send an e-mail?” Right. Now we have spoken about this over time. We’ve looked at different recent portion to put out. Anyway, one popped up in a HubSpot blog post that said, you know, here’s what we found about the best time to send e-mails, so I clicked it. And here was the title, “The best time to send an e-mail” and in parenthesis it says, “researched based” So I thought okay, that’s really interesting. Let’s read more about this. And so I’m gonna now share what they found. And then I’ll ask, pose a question about asking you why do you think this is the case. It said in general the highest quick to open rates are 10 a.m. at 21%, 1 p.m. at 22.5%, and have seen a spike at 6 p.m. The data reflects when most audiences begin, or conclude their day and have the most time to check their e-mails. Now one question to me here, said these numbers are from GetResponse, which is an e-mail marketing tool that has combined its diehard compile of report of e-mail marketing benchmarks. They analyzed four billion e-mails from 1,000 active senders. You know what, this raised a red flag to me. I went, hang on a second, that’s a lot of e-mails from a 1,000 senders, right. And then I thought, hang on, why did HubSpot not use the data from their own e-mail marketing system to create this report, or this research.

– Well, this is very weird, yeah first of all, four billion e-mails from a 1,000 senders. I think there’s some zeros missing somewhere.

– Yes.

– I have to check, but if they sent four billion e-mails from a million senders, and I’m like okay, they are probably numbers, let’s assume that’s a typo.

– Yes.

– But it’s very weird. But your question is, why are they using GetResponse starter then their own, I’m like, yeah what is going on here?

– Yeah, like.

– So, not that that means that the results or the findings aren’t relevant or useful. We should definitely but, I’m generally intrigued. Why are they using GetResponse starter, I’d love to know.

– Yeah, so here I am really perplexed, anyway.

– I don’t think I have a solution. You’ll remain perplexed as am I. But those times are interesting, aren’t they?

– They are interesting. Like the quick to open rate, so those just in case this ones thinking the highest is 21%, that’s not open rate, that’s click to open rate.

– Correct.

– So, did they actually mention what the open rates were as well, I’m assuming there are–

– Yes, they did.

– much higher than that.

– So, okay I’ll tell ya, so they got the open, they actually got open rates from something that campaign monitor had collected. So, now we’re talking a different e-mail marketing system.

– What is going on?

– And I’ll read this to you. So, it says the best data send through an e-mail and campaign monitor that collected data from millions of e-mails used on their service. They put together the best days to that pertains to data collection. All right, the best day for the highest e-mail open rates at 18.6% is Thursday.

– Well look, the other thing that I wanna mention, is take all of this with a grain of salt to your own test and measure. We’ve chat about this on the show before because I think take these as a guide for maybe where you start your testing.

– Sorry.

– But, always just, so how do you try and, there are so many variables. For example, if you’ve got a terrible subject line, doesn’t matter when you send it.

– Oh yeah, exactly.

– Right? You got a great subject line, oh, it probably will get opened, if it’s relevant, we’ve always talked about relevance. If it’s relevant, people will open it and look forward to it, and read it. If it’s not, they won’t. So it doesn’t matter when you send it, really. So this is why I’m kinda dubious. And I think test and measure in your own company. You might take benchmarks across an industry, it’s just a bit of a guide to start. But you gotta test this yourself.

– You’re absolutely right there, Craig. I remember when we use to deal with different businesses and a lot of the businesses that were, that we use to send e-mail marketing to, they were dealing with trainings. And so, we’d often send it specifically at times when they had their breaks because we discovered that that’s the time that they’re really open to, you know, they’re eating something, or smoking something–

– That’s a great insight, yeah.

– so, that’s when we targeted them, right?

– Right.

– Now if you’d told me that and said ah, no, we should send it at the first, you know, on a Thursday at this time, you might be like, why?

– You know the other thing that this doesn’t account for? High intent.

– Yes.

– Because I would like to see this go through what actually, what were the clicks, or what were the opens and then the clicks and then then form submits that then went into a deal that ended up in revenue. We’ve discussed this before, I’ve gotta hunch that a lot of that starts on a Sunday evening. People, they’re like, ah, they’re getting ready for the week so you prime them with something, like, ah yeah, I’ve got that. Yeah, I’ll fill that in ’cause I’m gonna chat with them this week. But, the open rate might be low, and the quick rate might be low, but the intent rate might be high. How do you test for that?

– Well, you’ve gotta have huge data sets. And apparently you’ve gotta get it out on the e-mail platforms there.

– So there we go, I don’t know if that’s provided you any insights but let’s talk about that. All right Craig, onto our insights of the week. He’s advertising the new dot com babble.

– Speaking of test and measure, this is a good segue because this is an article in the correspondent and you should go and read this because what they’re looking at is, is it worth paying for advertising, especially on things like your brand. And this article is good and bad. It’s good because it raises the question as well, you’ve got a test, but now are you testing the right things? And so it gives this great example of someone was testing whether you use coupons, this was an offline test but it relates to online notice that, a pizza shop are now testing whether coupons would drive more sales. And so this is a bit of one of the apocryphal stories I don’t know if it’s true or probably has some grain of truth but the three guys go out and they’re handing out their voucher coupons, it’s like, ah wow, one of these guys is really like, he’s really successful. Who was he targeting, where was he getting them, right? ‘Cause the rate of people using that coupon was really high. Anyway, so if you didn’t do the analysis, you go, “Right, well, that persons a star, “or that offer was really good.” Anyway, they asked and I said, “Ah, what have you been doing?” and he says, “Ah, I just stand in the line “in the pizza store and give them “while they’re queuing their order.” Right. So you could see the point, it’s like, well, obviously they were gonna buy it anyway, right. And so, take that simple example which may or may not be true, and apply it to your test. So, what the article raises is well, if people didn’t have the intent to buy–

– Yes.

– Did showing them an ad really reach them or are we just burning money ’cause they were gonna buy it anyway. So, obviously it’s a lot more complex. People have multiple touches and all that kind of thing. This article talks about that. So then, you’ve gotta take that and try to work out well, are we just re-targeting people that were gonna buy, what is it all they have campaigns, all those things, so, I don’t have answers for you ’cause it’s complex but the action item is to think about this, to start thinking, test and measure. Now, that’s the good part of the article. The bad part of the article is some of the conclusions they arrive at are based on studies and testing from 2012.

– Oh wow.

– Which is like, that’s an eternity ago in online advertising, so they’re like anybody who did this study and they found eBay didn’t wanna beat on their brand, you know, in Google you beat on your brand. And I think by now everyone knows they probably should. But five years ago, they’re like, ah, should we be beating on our brand? And so they stopped and all that went organic. So they’re like, ah, we don’t need to beat on our brand. Now, that was a great result for then. But of course, you should keep testing that because we know the Google results are not as simple as they were then. So when they throw in those kind of findings, you know, six years later or whatever, seven years later, and use it drive a conclusion that perhaps advertising is a waste of money, that’s where I fall down, so go onto this article thoughtfully. The action item I’m gonna take away is to test and measure as we always say.

– I mean, it is true, like I shared a search result I got the other day with you, and I wasn’t even looking for this I search for, I was looking at a particular fitness tracker and I just, I was trying to recall who I, I had it in a podcast I think somebody interviewed this particular person. They spoke about how they managed their life, and the things that they do to keep themselves at optimal level, right? So I thought, ah, I just wanna check this out. Anyway, so I was racking my brain to figure out, and so I just thought maybe one of the podcast I listen to I typed in that persons name with fitness tracker after it. And the result I got back I was like, I have never seen this before. Which was basically a video and had all the major key points in that video in like a timeline that you could kinda sift your way through. And then just had videos below. There was no text result or ad anywhere on that but I could see on the page initially, right? And I was blown away, so I took a screenshot and sent it to you, Craig. So, it just shows to me that what we know about search results has totally changed in what we see happen on a device when people are browsing. So there you have it, I think, just test and measure and be aware of what’s going on. Now Craig, you’ve gotta throwback of the week.

– I thought this would be interesting, also along this align of increments. Let’s throwback each week and say, what was HubSpot announcing 12 months ago. And you know what they were announcing 12 months ago?

– Content partitioning?

– Content partitioning. It was this new thing that they’re rolling out.

– Yes.

– It’s raw and acute today and it’s all across the platform and still getting better, so content partitioning, we’re all hanging out for it. And I think this came just on the hills of inbound at the times.

– It was, correct. All right, results of the week, Craig. And this is something I discovered. Somebody showed this to me this week. It’s a YouTube video so I recommend people watch it.

– We’ll probably share the link.

– Were you watching it ad free?

– Well, it was ad free when I started. It’s called the domino chain reaction. Yeah, it just blew my mind away how from a domino that was probably like five millimeters high, they knocked over a domino that was I think over a meter and a bit higher and so you just look at the scale of this tiny they used tweezers I think to put it on the ground.

– It just blew me away.

– So, you need to just explain the setup. The point is, when you have a row of domino’s they all knock each other over but you can increase each time the size of the domino. So increase it by 50% each time and you’ll and I think in the video showed there was like 13 steps from this tiny little thing that he started with tweezers, in and knocking over a meter tall one.

– It was quite amazing.

– And then when you get to 29 you can knock over the Empire State Building, apparently.

– Just I was, it blew me away to show you the power of something so small can gain momentum and do something so big.

– Good luck, Lil BUB.

– There you go. All right, quote of the week, Craig. And this is from Larry Page, “We should be building great things that don’t exist.”

– Now why have you chosen a Larry Page quote for today?

– Well, I chose a Larry Page quote, it was gonna be Larry or Sergey because they just stepped down from the head of Alphabet and they’ve let Sundar Pichai take over, so I thought that was a pretty momentous occasion and that’s what, here we are. Anything else, Craig?

– I think that’s it. We’d love you to leave us a review on Apple podcast and anyway you listen to this podcast. And we always love it when people e-mail us and actually say that they’ve learned something or just to say hi, and as we head towards the end of this year, we wanna thank you. Thank everybody for listening, being a part of the journey and supporting us over the last four years, and we hope you have a great holiday.

– Well Craig, until next time.

– Catch you later, Ian. Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of HubShots for show notes and the latest topics about news and tips please visit us at hubshots.com

Episode 184

Episode 184: HubSpot Increments

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about a bunch of incremental HubSpot and marketing updates. And then discuss how incremental updates over time amount to massive change.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/184-hubspot-increments/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

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Recorded: Wednesday 20 November 2019 | Published: Friday 3 January 2020

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

HubSpot HealthCheck

Has your HubSpot Portal got messy?

Brought to you by our HubSpot HealthCheck:


HubSpot Support as a guide

How we’ll know if HubSpot is gearing up to get acquired (eg by Google) – their investment in Support will drop off…

HubSpot Support is sooooo good. It would cost them a fortune to keep people trained so well. When they start cutting back on support to save $ and make their financials more attractive, we’ll know they are getting ready to be acquired.

But even worse, if they do get acquired, I hope their acquirer doesn’t look to slash costs and degrade the quality of the support (eg have you ever tried to contact Google Support? It’s very frustrating!)

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Image optimisation settings in Pro and Enterprise


hubspot image optimisation

Discovered via:


Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Product folders


Product Folders

Settings 17

Folders! The improvement that HubSpot is so proud of.

Here is some training you can do to Improve Sales Transparency with Quotes

Shot 4: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Ads add-on with Marketing Starter doesn’t show ROI

Ads   HubSpot 4

And doesn’t even show Customers

Ads   HubSpot 5

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week


A good reminder that you can use workflows to set properties on contact records, that could then add them to Active (Smart) lists that are then sync to audiences in Facebook and LinkedIn

Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Incremental change versus Massive change

It’s mostly a matter of timeframe

Craig got a new phone this week – upgrading from an iPhone SE to an iPhone 11 Pro

The change ‘appears’ to be massive, but of course if he’d just upgraded each year it would have seemed incremental.

Consider how impressed you’d be with HubSpot if the last time you used it was a few years ago, and then you used it again today.

Takeaway: Consider how your marketing has changed over the last few years. It may seem incremental to you, but considered over a larger timeframe you’ve probably achieved a massive change.

Shot 7: HubSpot Extra of the Week

Insight into the HubSpot Reporting Platform evolution


Speaking of incremental change – amazing to think that the team is only 3 years old – look how much they have achieved.

Wonderful post by Chelsea Bathurst:


Shot 8: YouTube of the Week



Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“Marketing is about values”

  • Steve Jobs

Shot 10: Bonus Thingies of the Week

When HubSpot imports WordPress posts via XML, it sets the User who created the post as ‘Hubspot System’ with a little ‘s’ in HubSpot:

hubspot imported post author

WSJ article about Google that was widely criticised in the SEO community:


Paying for privacy and less distractions:


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.
Episode 184: HubSpot Increments

– Hi, everyone. Welcome to HubShots, episode 184. In this episode, we chat about a bunch of incremental HubSpot and marketing updates, and then discuss how incremental updates over time amount to massive change. You’re listening to HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you Craig?

– I’m really good. And so many little things to go through today that add up to quite significant improvements.

– That’s right. So let’s talk about our growth thought of the week, Craig. And you have put together a HubSpot Health Check.

– Well look, I just wanted to mention this to people. It’s a service we offer. So folks, this is a bit of a plug for one of my own services. We don’t do this enough though, do we?

– Craig, this is your second plug in four years.

– I know. We don’t really promote our agencies, but look, this might be helpful to some of our listeners. It’s an audit. It’s called HubSpot Health Check. We go through your portal. And this really… You know, speaking of increments, you know how all you need to do is just go a bit lax on something, and over time, like you eat a bit too much sugar.

– Correct.

– You just gradually… No one gets fat overnight, right?

– That’s right.

– No one gets messy and .

– The belt just gets tighter.

– Yeah, it’s incremental thing. So if that’s your HubSpot portal, you’ve had it for a couple years, and it’s gone a bit out of control, naming conventions, lists all over the place, emails, and you need a bit of a health check to review it and get it back on track, we’ve got a little service for that. So we’ve got a link in the show notes. You can go and check it out. Now, I’ll tell you who it’s for. It’s normally bigger companies. So they’ve got Pro, or Enterprise. It’s not really a fit for people on Starter. But yeah, take a look at it. We’ve got a whole, yeah, really a health check we go through.

– Now Listeners,

– Get a bit of guidance, yeah.

– Craig’s playing this down, but he’s spent a lot of time putting this together from doing the landing page, to creating the video, and putting the whole thing together. So it’s not anything small. He has taken a lot of time to think about it and go through it, and it’s something that we’ve done together in the past when we have spoken to clients.

– Yeah, this is all based on client experience. In fact really what this is, it’s about productizing, Ian. You’ve got to productize.

– That’s right.

– It’s basically taking all the processes that we do with our clients when we look at their HubSpot portals and review it and make recommendations, and really just putting that into a checklist to go through.

– Now Craig, HubSpot support.

– Is there an episode that doesn’t go by where we don’t talk about how good HubSpot support is?

– No, there rarely is. I know in our conversations together, we talk about them quite a bit.

– They’re so good. And in fact, just today I was on a HubSpot support issue with a client that had an SSL issue. We tried to go live, but there was an SSL issue, and I was looking at help files. It’s all DNS by Amazon, Route 53 and all this kind of stuff. And I was like, “Ugh.” And their IT couldn’t work it out. We’re just going backwards and forwards. On the HubSpot support, they’re so smart. An engineer’s obviously been pulled into this, that they’ve done to test for an SSL propagation. They’re really… This is top notch support. So anyway, we should stop talking about how good it is. Here’s the indicator, and here’s what I was thinking about , at some point, HubSpot’s going to get acquired. Let’s say probably by Google. That’d be an obvious choice, right? Let’s say, how would we know that it’s coming up? And I was thinking, when their HubSpot support starts degrading a bit, just getting back to everyone else, that’s going to be an indicator that… Because, it must cost a fortune, all the training they do for HubSpot support, right?

– Yes.

– For their support team, they’re always there, quick to respond, very well trained. That would cost them a lot of money. When they start pulling back and saving money on support to beef up the financials for a takeover, I reckon that’s the flag. So if we ever see HubSpot support degrading, look out for an acquisition. That’s what I’d say.

– There’s Craig’s tip for the week right there.

– Yeah, my malarky prediction of the week.

– All right Craig, onto HubSpot market feature of the week.

– Let’s look at a really small incremental marketing feature improvement.

– And a really good one.

– And it’s a really good one, and this came from a HubSpot blog. In fact, this show I think has the most HubSpots blog links in it

– I know.

– For a while from episode because their blog posts have been quite good lately.

– And you know what’s interesting is the move to we have obviously a monthly product, video updates, and then the updates are shared on the product update blog, let’s say. But what’s interesting is we’re seeing all of these things, all these bits of content where they’re like, “Ah.” The one where we discovered this one from was like, here’s eight things you don’t know about the HubSpot CMS, right? And I’m like, “Oh. What eight things don’t I know?” It got me. It was a great title, got me clicking through and reading it.

– And it was good. It was actually a good article, lots of tips in there. In fact, we could actually do a show where all we did is pull out tips from that blog post. But the one we’ve highlighted today is this

– Is the gold.

– This new feature. It’s image optimization setting when you’re inserting an image.

– Yes.

– Have you seen this before?

– No, I hadn’t. And people are probably going, “Why do I care about this?” You know what? It’s like we had just discussed before. Eating too much food, images are fat, right? They’re optimized correctly, way too big. So listeners, when you see a page loading, or it’s taking a long time, and this image is gradually loading, it’s a fat image, and you need to optimize that. And now Google’s… Sorry, not Google. HubSpot.

– It’s not Google yet.

– Platform, and they’ve actually done it really nice, the way they’ve implemented it. It’s a little dropdown that says, “Do you want high quality, so you’re getting better image quality? Do you want default, which is balanced for speed and quality, which is good? And you’ve got low quality, which is fast a lot of times.” So you know what? On a mobile device, you might actually want… If you’re creating a page, well let’s say you’ve got this in a smart content module that only shows up on mobile devices, for example. You might actually choose the low quality, fast loading image for that particular page in this instance.

– You know what’s interesting, though? That just reminded me. You know how we used to say mobile was really slow?

– Correct.

– I reckon half the time my mobile speed is quicker than my home internet speed.

– That’s right.

– So it’s almost like switching it around where you’re saying, “Oh, if you’re on mobile, large image is no problem. But if you’re at home…” When you’re talking about Australian internet speeds, it’s so, so embarrassing here in Australia. It’s almost like if you’re on a home network or a work network, you want the lower, smaller sized images.

– Now Craig, onto our HubSpot sales feature of the week, and these are product folders.

– Ah look, its folders are hired. They’re so proud of their folders, aren’t they?

– Well you know what, this is about incremental improvement, Craig.

– Is this about incremental improvement?

– Now I discovered this issue when we were trying to demo this to a customer, a potential customer, was that they had a massive product catalog. And one of the problems we’ve had is how do we organize products when you’ve got a catalog of a couple hundred items in there appropriately?

– Wow. So a couple hundred products.

– Yes.

– Wow. That’s…

– That was a lot. That was a challenge. And when I was speaking to them, folders weren’t out. It even came from HubSpot. They were like, “Oh, you need to actually name these correctly, so you can find it better.” And that was the solution. But now that we have folders, that’s going to solve a lot of problems. Regardless to say, there is a whole blog post about products and quotes, and about the tools. That’s in five recent updates.

– All right. And look, I just want to say, I’m not saying folders are a bad idea. You know how I’m bagging them out for promoting folders as this new amazing feature. I’m not saying, “Ah, that’s not a good feature.” I’m saying, “Of course.” Why wasn’t this in there from the start? This is not a feature, this is table stakes. So that’s my comment, but you’re right. It’s incremental improvement, and-

– That’s right, and I think-

– It was needed.

– That’s exactly right, and I think when they probably built this feature out, they probably had a handful. I’d say probably under 50 products that would’ve gone in there. Because that’s what people used it for, not realizing that people had hundreds, if not thousands of products that they wanted to load into HubSpot.

– It makes sense, doesn’t it? You could have a huge product catalog. And I know because we used to link our Shopify site into Hubspot. They don’t support that anymore, but that potentially for ecommerce, that could’ve brought in hundreds or thousands of products. So it makes sense.

– All right. On the blog post, there was some really interesting… That’s interesting CTA this is. Here’s some training you can do to improve your sales transparency with quotes. And I thought that was rather interesting. So it’s a little lesson, and a practicum after that about how to do that. Now in products, you will see, and this got highlighted by a customer of ours who we’re implementing products for that people could buy using the new buy button. So they were saying, okay, let’s take for example it’s a thousand dollar product. There’s a field there to put in your margin, right? So you can say, “Look, that product actually cost me 500 bucks. I’m selling it for a thousand.” They’re like, “Ah, do we need to put that in there, or can we just leave that blank? Because we don’t want the people that work for us to know how much that product is costing.” So I thought, “Yeah, okay. Cool. You don’t need to.” But I said, “By having the margin in there, is going to give you the ability to understand what you’re actually making, in terms of the sale.”

– So help me here. I can’t think of a good example of where not, of where hiding that would be bad. So you’re talking about the sales team, right?

– Yes, correct.

– Because they want to use products in quotes.

– Yep. Yes.

– And deals.

– Yep.

– What’s the benefit of withholding that, and them not knowing that?

– I’m just using a real life experience.

– No, but in the client’s mind, what was their justification for it?

– I don’t know. Maybe they didn’t want to know how much they were making on that particular product.

– Oh, right.

– That’s my suspicion.

– That’s weird. Okay.

– Anyway, the whole idea obviously in this whole sales transparency, if you know that, and you can apply discounts to products and quotes, you’ll make sure that you don’t apply a discount less than the real value of that product, right? So if you know that it was $1,000, and we were buying it for 500, I’m not going to discount it 50% to get rid of it, or 75% because I’m actually losing money now.

– Right. Oh, of course.

– Anyway, there’s some good training there by Kyle Jepson, so head over to the academy. It’s linked there.

– Oh, Kyle’s great. Actually, we featured him last week as well, didn’t we?

– I know, Kyle.

– Kyle.

– Kyle’s getting a regular-

– ICCPA, that’s right, in the episode.

– That’s right.

– Good one, Kyle.

– All right, onto our Gotcha of the week, Craig.

– Incremental opportunity for improvement here this Gotcha.

– It’s all about growing better. Now why I picked this up is because we use a lot of… We have a lot of accounts. Marketing Starter, we’ve had to add that on because we run ads. We do some email marketing, we make our landing page. Anyways, so I’m here thinking, having used the ads add-on in marketing professional enterprise thinking, “Yeah, this is fantastic. I’ll get the ads add-on, be able to track everything.” Anyway, I’m like, “Hang on.” I’m trying to work out the ROI here. It’s got a little padlock beside. Okay, I’ll ignore that for a little while. I want to add a column to see which of those contacts turn into customers. Oh hang on, that’s got a padlock too. I can’t add that column. So I don’t know whether these… And I thought, “Hang on. I bought the ads add-on. Why don’t I have this?” Anyway, there you go. You don’t get it. If you’re on Marketing Starter, you need to be on Marketing Professional and upwards to have those two features unlocked.

– I can see it both ways with the ROI. I think that’s dissappointing that they don’t show up when you’ve paid for the ads add-on.

– I agree.

– I can kind of understand it. ROI is a pro feature. But not showing a customer?

– Yes. In the column.

– That’s a life…

– In the column, right?

– That’s a life cycle stage.

– That seems petty.

– I think that’s a mistake.

– I know, and then I’m going to have to now do a little work around to figure out what’s going on, as to who began customers. I mean, I guess in a simplistic, if you don’t have heaps of data, you could click on the contacts in the the generate contacts in the ads section.

– Yeah, sure.

– And then click who has become, or create a list.

– Look, there’s a whole psychology, and I am sure the people at HubSpot spent a lot of time thinking about this. They’d be very clear on what we’re going to include, and what’s part of an upsale. But as an end user, there’s two ways you upsale. One is aspirational. Oh, that’s great. I would love to be able to do that. And two is, there’s a hurdle I need to get over. I need that for my job, and you’re frustrating me into the upsale. And this second one is clearly in the latter. It seems out of character for HubSpot. Normally when I see those padlocks, I go, “Yeah, well that’s fair enough.” That’s quite a lot of advanced functionality, or that’s quite a aspirational feature set would be good. But when it’s just… Yeah, this one just seems odd to me.

– Yeah, I can understand ROI. But the customer column, I don’t get that.

– Yeah, that’s the one I mean. Customer column seems weird.

– All right. Onto our market of the week, Craig.

– Speaking of ads.

– That’s right, about automating your ads in HubSpot.

– Yeah, so another blog post, HubSpot blog post. It’s quite good. Read the whole post, but this is a reminder that you can set workflows. Use workflows to set properties, so by workflows, of course we’re talking HubSpot Pro or Enterprise, to set properties that would impact whether a contact goes into a particular smart list or active list, and then those lists can be synced as audiences, so to Facebook, LinkedIn, et cetera. So this is just a reminder on that. You can use workflows to be segmenting your list, and that just flows through thanks to the ads add-on connecting audiences into those social channels. I think this is really good. So you might be doing retargetting audiences and things like that. Workflows are your friend. How often have we been saying that lately? It’s all workflow. It doesn’t matter what the question is. The answer is HubSpot workflows.

– Yes, this is a really good reminder to me. We run lots of ads across pretty much every client. I just forgot. I had seen these options in the workflow. You can choose by a particular Facebook campaign name, Facebook ID, et cetera. And I thought to myself, “Oh, hang on.” I did something where I was actually using lead ads to get people to download a particular guide, and I thought, “Okay. Well I could actually have the next thing as a followup to send them the frequently asked questions in email.” Which I had, maybe two days later, sent them a frequently asked questions email, and I can do that because I know that I can trigger it based on their ad, or I’ll put them into a list, et cetera. It was a good reminder, thank you. Insider of the week, Craig.

– All right, so we’ve been talking about incremental improvements in HubSpot, or marketing in general, I guess. I wanted to just share an experience that I’ve had lately. So I upgraded my phone on the weekend.

– Now Craig, you upgraded your phone not from an iPhone let’s say 8 or 10, but from an iPhone SE.

– That’s right. Which, I love this little phone because I really love that really form factor. An iphone, so folks, this is many years old, and I upgraded to an iPhone 11 Pro, which is amazing. Okay? So I mean, you might not like… For someone that’s not on IOS, if you’re on the Android, I don’t know what the equivalent is.

– Probably the Pixel. Actually a Galaxy.

– Assume an Android phone from four or five years ago to one brand new today, right? The change is incredible, and why am I talking about this? Because it’s like, yeah, of course. I mean, when you use outdated technology, of course. Here’s the thing, the change is so stark and so incredible for me. I am just in amazement at this phone. Whereas, I know you’ve upgraded a lot more regularly than me. It would’ve seemed like an incremental change to you. So for me, I’m just like my goodness. The camera is so incredible. The speed on this thing is so incredible, even just downloads. Even just wi-fi. It’s not our internet speed at home. It’s the phone. It’s just incredible.

– It’s the connection, yes.

– And the battery, I just leave it all day. I don’t have to recharge. Everything about this is incredible. It’s so much better.

– The stereo speakers.

– Speakers. Look, I could go on and on, right? But the point I’m making is, well let’s take another thing like HubSpot. Imagine the last time you used HubSpot was two years ago, and then you used it today. You’d be like, “Wow, this is a different product.” It’s got more hubs, for starters. It would be so much better. And the point, which is obvious, that I’m making is that incremental changes, the timeframe is what sets how massive those changes are. So comparing it over two years you go, “Wow. HubSpot is incredible compared to two years ago.” In the same way, I’m like, “Man, this phone is incredible compared to four or five years ago.” So think about your own marketing though because as a marketer, you might think, “Oh, I’m just plugging away, doing a little bit here and improving a little bit there.” This is what we often talk about, incremental improvements in our marketing. But you as a marketer, you as a person, you could be a massively better marketer than you were a couple years ago, and you just don’t realize it. And in some ways, you need to be. So the takeaway from this little section is twofold. One is don’t get down or feel down that… Even just improving a bit each day, and that’s even with this show. We want our… Dear listener, we want you to just improve one thing in using HubSpot, or doing marketing, especially marketing automation because incrementally over time, it has a massive impact. And the second thing of course is if you aren’t improving, if you’re just sitting there doing the same old thing each day, then you’re falling behind. And while you might not see that in a month or two, over a year or two, you are going to be way behind all the other marketers in your field. So just I guess a reminder to be continually learning, but don’t feel it has to be huge in spikes in a month. Over time, these really add up to quite a massive change.

– All right. Onto the HubSpot Extra of the week, Craig. It’s a really good blog post about insight into the HubSpot reporting platform evolution.

– So speaking of incremental change, so you know the reporting system? They’ve only been there for three years. Three years ago, there was no reporting engine.

– I know, which is really surprising.

– We laugh at that now. We should look back at how many integrations that they had a couple years ago.

– Yes.

– They’re a platform now. Right? Things change rapidly, and so three years I guess is a long time. But look how far they’ve come.

– Yeah.

– This blog post by Chelsea, is a really interesting insight into how they’ve embraced that along the way. Removing pain, basically getting people to a better place, and incremental improvement over time.

– And even just setting standards. I’ve read in the blog post, having standards about what they will and will not do, and being consistent in the outputs. One of the things I was saying, in how they visualize stuff, so having that consistency about how they report on things, big thing. If you look at the reporting and the things we get out of it, and we share with customers, it is constant improvement, right? It’s visually appealing. When we often show this to other people that might get the same information from other platforms, they’re often like, “Oh wow, that makes so much more sense to us in this format versus looking at it in this other format,” even though we might be telling them exactly the same thing.

– You know, that reminded me of another thing, just that whole UI update. Remember, well, how long ago was it, a year or two?

– Yes, they started.

– They started changing the colors and the look and feel.

– Correct.

– And imagine, at the start of that process, that must’ve looked like a daunting job. Oh, we’ve got to update the entire suite. That’s a big task.

– Yes.

– They just broke it down by chunks, and each month they’d be, “Oh, we’ve updated the interface on this, and then this changed.” They’re going through the same process with workflows at the moment.

– They are.

– Changing the whole workflow engine for context.

– Yes.

– Behind the scenes, right? Just incrementally doing it. And then, what do you know, a year’s gone by, and it’s actually totally different. Compare that to say other products, something at Salesforce who’ve now, they’ve got their new version, which is a complete new wrapper, and all the frustrations that go with that, people having to learn a new system. And then not only that, some features aren’t there, so I’ve got to go back into the old system just to do that thing that we… It’s a totally different approach.

– Even people building new wrappers in front.

– Yeah, well that’s right. I guess it all just comes back to this incremental improvement. It’s compounds, it’s your friend.

– Sure is. Now Craig, we’ve got a really good video. It’s been doing the rounds, and it’s about Steve Jobs on marketing. And we sat here and watched it together. You know what? Pretty ballsy, I have to say.

– From 1997, when he launched the Think Different Campaign, and he just talks about what marketing is, there should be a quote of the week for that.

– Yeah, and you know what, if you are in marketing, and if you’re in sales, I would recommend you actually take the time to watch this video from start to finish. You will get some nuggets out of it, guaranteed.

– The man was a master.

– Sure was. Until he wore those shorts, Craig. Anyway, quote of the week from the late Steve Jobs, “Marketing is about values.” Now Craig, we have anything as a bonus for out listeners?

– We’ve got some bonus thingies of the week, and I’ll just highlight. I found a spot where, an unusual oversight by HubSpot. If you import blog posts into the system, e.g. word posts you know who they set the user as who’s created that post? I’m showing a user account called Hubspot

– System.

– System. But the S in HubSpot is lowercase. They haven’t followed conventions. Who cares about this? I’m sure no one cares, but I just noticed that, and I thought that…

– That is a very good pick up, Craig.

– That’s a rare oversight on someone’s part.

– That’s right.

– And then we’ve got some articles as well.

– And this is not going to be in the show. Craig, now that you’ve got an iPhone 11 Pro, extra large screen, what is your favorite app? Tell me the top three things that you love about this phone.

– That I love about the phone, or the apps that I use?

– Well, could be a combination.

– Reading. I read a lot on my phone. My phone is a consumption device. I don’t do much work on it, so I might occasionally check emails, but I very rarely do work on the phone. It’s a consumption device. So I read a lot on Kindle and blog readers. I use the Kindle. Probably the Kindle app is the biggest time use on the phone. So viewing that on the bigger screen is just beautiful. And I also read a lot of blogs. And I do a bit of Twitter, actually. That’s good to read. You know the app I found recently is the Apple News app, the News Plus.

– Yes.

– Which launched in Australia. I know it’s been around in the US for ages, but in Australia, it was only the last month or two.

– Correct.

– And it looks really good.

– Yes, by you showing it to me, you surprised me what was inside there. I’m going to go have a look at it.

– Yeah, and I’m just in the free trial at the moment, but reading all of these magazines that I have access to, I think it would be even better on an iPad, a big iPad with a beautiful screen.

– Yes.

– Because these are these great magazines.

– Yeah, so listeners, just so you know, the Apple News Plus app is actually not just news. It actually includes a lot of very well known magazines that a lot of people would read regularly. I was actually really surprised. I thought, I’ve got news. Why do I need that? Anyway, there’s a little tip for you. Well listeners, we hope you enjoyed the show. We’d love you to leave us a rating on Apple podcast. Share this episode with someone who would benefit, who actually uses HubSpot, or is considering using HubSpot. Until next time, Craig.

– Catch you later, Ian.

– Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news, including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at hubshots.com.

Episode 183: HubSpot ads reports on Dashboards, HubSpot template gotcha, CCPA

Episode 183: HubSpot ads reports on Dashboards, HubSpot template gotcha, CCPA

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about adding ad reports on HubSpot dashboards, avoiding template gotchas, and whether you need to prepare for CCPA.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/183-hubspot-ads-reports-on-dashboards-hubspot-template-gotcha-ccpa/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

Join the Facebook group here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hubshots/

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Connect with Ian on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianjacobau/

Connect with Craig on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigbailey/

Recorded: 14 November 2019 | Published: 13 December 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Connect with us on LinkedIn

Connect with Ian on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianjacobau/

Connect with Craig on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craigbailey/

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

HubSpot Enterprise Workflows limit

HubSpot has increased the number of workflows in Enterprise portals from 500 to 1000.

Would love to know how many portals were hitting the 500 workflow limit. And how many does HubSpot itself have? Would love to know.

Add HubSpot Ads reports to Dashboards

There are a bunch of Ads related reports you can add to your dashboard:

Reports library

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week


Why? Save time writing emails and taking notes

You can create shortcuts to your most common responses in emails and notes logged in HubSpot CRM. Quickly send emails and log notes without having to type the same thing over and over!  This also includes have personalisation in your snippets.

Users often forget it is available in your email too!

Inbox  790    ian jacob searchandbefound com au   Search   Be Found Mail

Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

CCPA overview by Kyle on HubSpot Academy:



CCPA = California Consumer Privacy Act:


Shot 5: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

PieSync Login

PieSync login process is infuriating – sends you a verification code to your email every time you need to login. We have abandoned using PieSync due to this.

Adding Rich Text Modules to Templates

Adding Rich Text modules to templates – need to set the default text to be blank, otherwise, you’ll suddenly start seeing this kind of text appear on pages that use the template:

hubspot rich text

Either clear it out altogether or set it to something that will be relevant on the page eg on a Thank you page:

hubspot heading

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Resending emails to get a better open rate.  So what we did was create an active list:

Did not open JITT Special  retail    Lists

We then cloned the email and changed the Subject and sent it a few days later.  You will see we managed to get an additional 22%-26% open rate.

Reports dashboard 13Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Being Better Versions of Ourselves (as Marketers):


Incremental improvement => compounds

Shot 7: Podcast of the Week

Marketing from the trenches


Good episode chatting about what’s working on Facebook these days:


From Will Wang at Growth Labz:


Shot 8: Resource of the Week

Basecamp have released a free Personal version:


Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success.”

– Henry Ford

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

HTTP status codes:


SEObook: Brands versus Ads:


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 183 HubSpot ads reports on Dashboards, HubSpot template gotcha CCPA.jpg

– [Ian] Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 183. In this episode we chat about adding ad reports on HubShots dashboards, avoiding template gotchas, and whether you need to prepare for CCPA. You’re listening to HubShots the podcast for marketing majors and sales professionals who are using HubSpot hosted by myself, Ian Jacob, from search and be found, and Craig Bailey from Xen Systems. How are you Craig?

– [Craig] I’m really good, how are you Ian?

– [Ian] Excellent.

– [Craig] You’ve had a long day haven’t you?

– [Ian] It feels like that.

– [Craig] Yeah we need to go and get dinner after this, don’t we?

– [Ian] That’s correct. Well Craig onto our growth thought of the week.

– [Craig] You know I just wanted to say, I’m trying to get to use LinkedIn more.

– [Ian] So am I actually.

– [Craig] Not necessarily to sell or even for mark, ’cause we’ve done paid marketing through LinkedIn but I’m just trying to get connections with people. I think that’s going to be my network–

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] For connecting with people because as you know I’m not on Facebook, I avoid Instagram, I just lurk on Twitter, I kinda lurk on LinkedIn. I’m actually gonna try and use it to connect with people, coming out of my shell a bit so with that in mind, I’ve put both our personal LinkedIn profiles, not the HubShots one, but our personal LinkedIn profiles in shot on show notes so– [Ian] And yeah if you’re connecting tell us your listeners of the show.

– [Craig] Yeah, connect with us, ’cause I would like, I get so many connections, which I kinda accept a lot of them with random people just connecting and they just wanna sell me stuff–

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] I’d much rather connect with our listeners so that if they’ve got a question you know just ask a question, I’d love to be helping people on LinkedIn rather than kind of batting away people trying to sell me stuff that is not a fit at all.

– [Ian] That’s right, I agree with you Craig. So yes listeners connect with us, we’d love to hear from you guys. Alright Craig onto marketing feature of the week, hot off the press–

– [Craig] Well before we get to your nice find with the ads reports, this announcement that HubSpots increased the number of work flows you can have in an enterprise portal from 500 to a thousand. First of all I didn’t know there was a limit so–

– [Ian] Well you know what, I didn’t know there was a limit until I saw that message in my portal.

– [Craig] I wondered, well I’m assuming the limit was there and they have increased it because people have been hitting their limit and so they’re probably going, “Oh, we need to increase this,” I would love to know how many portals are hitting the limit, I’d love to know the telemetry on this. Obviously HubSpot has all of this, like I’d love to see some of those portals if someone needs 600, 700, work flows, like I was looking at our portal and I think ours is pretty complex around a bunch of businesses out of it.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] That you know my wife–

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] And my own businesses, and I was like well we’ve got about 200 work flows in our portal and we’re pretty complex, pretty sophisticated. I’d love to see some of these big ones that need more than 500. I’d love to see them. Not only the breakdown but how they use–

– [Ian] How complex they are.

– [Craig] Yes. Because some of the portals we go into with our bigger clients, when we take up the portals, they’re like massively complex work flows always branching, all kinds of things going on, like how does someone maintain this? And that’s something we look at with our, we’ve got a HubSpot health check audit service that we do, I’d love to get a sense of some of those big ones. I would love to know HubSpots work flows, you know I’d almost take a job at HubSpot just so that I could peek into their work flows and get a sense of how, ’cause they’ve got, not only would they have so many across all their regions but they have had them for years.

– [Ian] That’s right.

– [Craig] I would like to go in chronological order and go back to some of their work flows that they first created years ago, right at the start, and just see how that’s changed. I think that would be fascinating to see the evolution of how they’ve used work flows.

– [Ian] Yeah, absolutely right, Craig.

– [Craig] Anyway, that was just the first little feature, the increase, but you found–

– [Ian] That’s right and I was doing this because I had been doing a lot of paid advertising for customers lately and I was thinking, well they’re using, and actually they’re on marketing status so I went “oh, I wonder what reports there are” because I could never find any reports like every time someone asked you about ads you’d have to go to the ads tool. Anyway I found some reports, I’m like, “oh here we go.” Now mind you, four out of the six reports, actually all the reports had to do with social, social ads, the other two actually talk about ad campaigns with Casper Click and Casper Contact and that runs across Google Ads, LinkedIn, and Facebook Ads, and you’ll see the data in a table but the four that I wanna highlight is they have four reports which is ad impression by social network, ad clicks by social networks, ads attributed contacts by social network, and ads attributed customers by social network, and you know what? I put them on the dashboard to show them and I think it’s actually useful especially if you’re running lots of social ads.

– [Craig] I think this is really good and I’d love to know if this has been here for awhile, we should ask, we should ask George Bay Thomas.

– [Ian] We find these things and then we check with other people and go “oh yeah that’s been there for ages,” I can’t remember that one thing I found I was so excited I was like– we put it in the HubSpot WhatsApp thread and Charles said, no, no I’ve had that for months. I was like, aw I just must’ve missed it, there’s so many good things, that we miss it, but this does ring a bell, remember when they were moving it, they were changing up the social reports?

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] They were moving some of the stuff out of the social tour and then they were just making some reports I think they added some, they also, um, what’s the word when they get rid of stuff?

– [Ian] Grandfather?

– [Craig] Grandfather–

– [Ian] Oh no.

– [Craig] Someone, no.

– [Ian] Sunset?

– [Craig] Sunset, yeah, sunset, just when they got rid of them so I wonder if that was around the same time–

– [Ian] Quite possibly.

– [Craig] Ad ones in yeah.

– [Ian] ‘Cause I been looking for ad stuff in the reports, I should really call these widgets ’cause they know reports.

– [Craig] I know I always have to catch myself there, I think of a report as a solid full page thing.

– [Ian] Exactly. So, anyway, regardless I think this is valuable. So, if you are using HubSpot and you are running social ads, I would go and add this to your dashboard.

– [Craig] We should just call it in the show, “report widgets”–

– [Ian] “Report widgets.”

– [Craig] Add these “report widgets” to your dashboard. I think that makes much more sense.

– [Ian] Let’s go into the HubSpot sales pitch of the week, Craig. And I wanted to highlight snippets, and we’ve done this a few times.

– [Craig] Snippets are so good with– What do we love? Lead forms. They know how to, called Popup forms–

– [Ian] Correct, exactly.

– [Craig] Snippets, is like our next current favorite.

– [Ian] Absolutely, why would I highlight these, been training a few customers this week, and one of the features that always stands out, and people are like “Wow! Can we do that? Can we– Can we use it this way?” And I’m like, “Yes, you can.” So the whole theme is you want to save time, right? Who knows, even maybe standardize your responses for certain things across the team, so snippets are available to everyone. And it’s really about creating shortcuts so, one of the examples I’m given you before is that you can use a snippet in a task, for example. So one of the sales team was sending, uh, need to send a task to someone that counts, really create an account for this customer. They have to give them their ABN and give them a couple other details, which uh, they can collect in HubSpot. I said, “Well, how do you do that?” So then they’ve got to go to ABRR, cut and paste the ABN, then find the other details.

– [Craig] I remember this one, yeah.

– [Ian] I said, “Why don’t I just create a snippet for you, where you can put a task to that person in accounts, and you just ‘go can you please create account for blah, here it is.” And it will preview the ABN, it will preview all of these, and I was like, “Yeah, let’s do that.” And so that’s a really perfect example of how to use a snippet really well, when you’re using a system. Now, the other thing to note here is, Someone said, “Oh, can I use that in my email?” Most of our clients use Google mail, so it is there, it’s a bit hidden, and so I put a screenshot in the notes, because people seem to document sequences and a few other things, but they don’t realize snippets is hiding in this more menu, and it can be used. So, it’s a great place to utilize it. And think about ways, that you can help your team respond quicker, and bring consistency to your business.

– [Craig] I really like it, I think we should add a new shot next week called, “Reminder of the week,” which is just, one is Popup Forms, well, two use snippets, wherever you can.

– [Ian] And use LEAD.DAT–

– [Craig] And LEAD.DATs.

– [Craig] Well now we’ve got three things.

– [Ian] That was the bonus tip, Craig.

– [Craig] Bonus tip, right there.

– [Ian] Alright so, this is the HubSpot extra of the week, Craig, and we’re going to talk about CCPA. And there’s a good overview video from Kyle.

– [Craig] Yes, thank you Kyle.

– [Ian] Now, Craig. For those of us who don’t know what CCPA is, would you like to elaborate?

– [Craig] Yes, so very quickly I’ll summarize it, and I think we talked about this in a show halfway through the year, word that it was coming. So, if you think of– everyone knows JDPR, which was, I’ll just call it the privacy apocalypse thing that had to be added, uh, very European focused. CCPA is the California Consumer Privacy Act, and you’ll probably see it referred to as JDPA for the US. Now, I’ll say the US, because it only applies to California although it may, other states may adopt it. But, I think a number of companies are going to say “Look, we’re going to support CCPA all across America– The America’s,” so it’s kind of the American version of the JDPR, however, it’s a lot less stringent. And so this overview by Kyle, it’s a seven minute video, it just walks you through, and of course watching it 1.5 or 2x, like you should watch all videos and listen to all podcasts– By the way, we had someone leave us a comment the other day

– [Ian] We did!

– [Craig] “By the way, I listened to your podcast 1x speed!” I’m like, what? Who is this person? Who is this anon? I don’t know. Then you said I think your wife listens to that one.

– [Ian] She does.

– [Craig] She likes to absorb, yeah, anyway I digress, you can watch this in four minutes is what I’m saying. Kyle’s overview of CCPA is worth doing, I’ve included a slide from his video about it, ’cause it doesn’t apply to everyone, like JDPR did apply to everyone, I was very–

– [Ian] It does.

– [Craig] It does apply to everyone, it’s not like you kind of was so small that it didn’t apply. CCPA is a bit more realistic, I would say, in terms of the businesses that have to be a certain size, revenue sizes, certain number of database sizes. And so, I’m not going to– well, I’ve got a slide in the show notes, I don’t know if I want to mention them ’cause they may change, but I think they are a guide, but to give you a sense, it’s like a multi-million dollars, like a twenty-five million dollar revenue companies this applies to, so if you’re a small business, you don’t necessarily have to panic like he, kind of had to.

– [Ian] You know, one thing that I find interesting on this slide, about who CCPA applies to, was it says derived more than fifty percent of annual revenue from selling consumers personal information!

– [Craig] Right, and Kyle makes a good comment about that, he says, “Oh, just don’t do that.”

– [Ian] So, that helps you out. But you know, there are information brokers, like that’s a big business, and– Yeah, absolutely, Craig.

– [Craig] And did you listen to this week’s episode of Pivot? The Scott Galloway and Kara Swisher podcast.

– [Ian] I did listen to one.

– [Craig] When I talked about how data– people are selling data for uni enrollments in order to match people, whether they qualify–

– [Ian] Really?

– [Craig] It’s just shocking what’s going on.

– [Ian] Wow.

– [Craig] In terms of Unis, you know, targeting people who they will let enroll and all this kind of thing so, data selling and data usage is such a power business, I’m not saying that’s a good thing, in fact, I think that’s a bad thing in many ways, but it’s just so, the norm now. That criteria on CCPA is going to apply to a lot of companies.

– [Ian] Alright, Craig. Onto HubSpot Gotcha of the week. Now this is, uh, let me just say, a new acquisition HubSpot, PieSync.

– [Craig] We mentioned it in passing last episode about HubSpot acquiring PieSync, which is an integration tool so think of it as a PR, but contact-centric. I mean, I think it fits very well with Hubspot. It’s integrating with other platforms– Did you know HubSpots a platform company?

– [Ian] I did, Craig.

– [Craig] Wow, how did– How did I miss that? No, I didn’t. A bit of an inject, sorry dismiss it. Anyway, PieSync is this integration tool, which I thought great, because…

– [Ian] Yeah, which I’ve also tried, in the past and I’m thinking about trying again.

– [Craig] Now the thing that infuriates me about it, is the login process. Have you tried this lately?

– [Ian] I haven’t tried it lately, Craig, and I don’t recall it doing what it does now when I tried it a few months ago.

– [Craig] I’ll just recap the user experience for you, so you sign up, whenever you log in, you put your email address in next, then it emails you a code, which you have to go to email, find the code, and either click or put in the code back in the PieSync log in to log in.

– [Ian] So there’s no password?

– [Craig] There’s no password.

– [Ian] Right.

– [Craig] Now there are other options, you can log in with LinkedIn or Google, which we don’t want to do. It’s infuriating. Anyway, this is such a hurdle, I can’t– Anyway, I’ve been backwards and forth complaining with their support and their sites for security and you know their other option, and it’s just like, this is so ridiculous. It’s such a bad experience. Especially for agencies and for clients, right? So, we’ll say to a client, “I set up the PieSync account,” Well, actually, we’re not going to say that. ‘Cause we’re just not going to use PieSync for this, this single reason, but normally at Zapier, We’ll say, “Oh yeah, set up the Zapier account, just send us the logs in, we’ll set up your Zapiers for you, right?” So can you imagine, they send us that and they’re like, “Every time we want to log in, you’re going to get an email with a code–

– [Both] Can forward the code for us

– [Craig] So that we can log in with it, that’s just infuriating. That’s just so unworkable. Surely, just use 2-factor authentication or some other means, but we as an agency, we store our clients passwords, we use last password, we’ve got a very strong process around it, and most staff don’t have access to all the passwords, it’s just shared on the, you know, so we’re very careful– that’s the way we work it for the clients. This seems like such a bad process.

– [Ian] Before we proceed, tell me the reason you do not log in using, say Facebook or Google, if that’s available.

– [Craig] So, well in PieSync’s case, when you log in with that account, actually the Zapier– Not the Zapier, whatever the connection–

– [Ian] The syncing.

– [Craig] Actually to that log in, so even though you have other team members, they don’t see the shared, um connections to that account. Right, we and would never want to log in with LinkedIn, ’cause then that’s my LinkedIn log in, I want to share that with the team.

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] And clients want to share these kinds of things with us, so username, password–

– [Ian] Unless it supports multiple log ins.

– [Craig] Right, and well, a number of tools don’t. So Zapier doesn’t. We have one, you know, normally the client gives us–

– [Ian] Access.

– [Craig] Now, of course, if a tool does give access and many other tools do, whether we can just share permissions, of course, we would use that. But yeah, it’s just, I just don’t understand why they’ve gone down this path, they’ve got a whole knowledge base article, so I’ve totally hijacked this, and think, I’m so infuriated by this.

– [Ian] I can tell, Craig.

– [Craig] And it’s just like this is– I just thought it was such a great tool that would answer a lot of the problems that we’ve got with syncing for clients, and we’re just not going to use it. And all my team agree, it’s just this is unusable. I just don’t get it. Anyway–

– [Ian] Well, that’s it– I mean, that’s interesting. Now that you’ve explained it, it actually makes more sense to me so, it’s a good point.

– [Craig] So look, I hope the HubSpot acquisition cautions this ridiculous process, Hubspot should–

– [Craig] You realize, this is an agency tool, it’s just not going to work, thanks just get rid of that malake.

– [Ian] Alright, I think which ticks modules on the templates, Craig, now here’s a gotcha for you. As to why you need to, just set them up correctly.

– [Craig] Alright, so. Got called out by this, this is such a facepalm. We’ve got thank you pages and download pages, and I actually sent one of our offerings to Daniel Burchi. I said– Hi Daniel, by the way, um, if you’re– and I said, I’ve got this new service offering and I’d be interested in feedback. You know, what do you think of it? He sent a ton of great feedback, thanks so much. So, but, do you realize that on your thank you page, you sign up to inquire about it, there’s a big chunk of text that says-

– [Ian] Tell the readers something about–

– [Craig] Yeah, you know that default text, and it’s like aw, no. Facepalm! So what’s happened is, we’ve had this template, you know in place, and then someone is needed to add a bit more content to the thank you page for specific circumstance. So, go into the template or just pop in a rich text module there, no worries, but it’s, of course it’s got all the default text. Of course, every page based on their template suddenly sprouting this “something about”, it’s like oh no! Anyway, so that’s the gotcha. Not a HubSpot product problem, a user said “I found the problem! It’s between the chair and the keyboard. I found the problem!” Anyway, to overcome the gotcha fix, whenever you’re putting any text based modules on a template, just clean out the text, or set it to very default words that wouldn’t matter if they appeared.

– [Ian] Alright, Craig. My market tip of the week, and I want to highlight this, about resending emails to get a bit open rate, and I’ve given an example here, it’s just a costumer we’ve moved onto HubSpot, and I was telling, and they had open rates of about 25-30% thinking ah, I think we could do better than this. Anyway, we were sending out some campaigns, there’s got to be a bit of segmentation and so on, but essentially, what we did was we were able to really easily, and if you don’t know this, you should be using this, in HubSpot is create an active listed HubSpot where you can use the criteria of someone received the particular market email, but did not open it and create that list, then what we did was we cloned the email that we originally sent, we changed the subject slightly, and we then resent that to this new list in essence and what we got was, so the first email said, and I’ll just pick one, here we go, we got a 36% open rate, right?

– [Craig] Which is pretty good.

– [Ian] Yep, and I thought hey I can do better than this, and then I resent it about three days later with a slightly different subject to the unopened list, so I got another almost 22% That little action, has driven so much more sales and engagement it’s been amazing, so I just wanted to highlight this because, people are probably not doing this and it’s a really good way to get in front of people because sometimes people will see things or see your emails and they might not actually look at it. Whereas, if you sent it a few days later, they might actually have time to look at it because I know for a fact, like once my email inbox has gone– passed like a couple of days, like, I don’t go back to look at anything, so I know like Gmail now resurfaces things like after three or five days, says oh like do you want to respond to these or should you respond to this because it’s using the smarts behind the system. So it’s good, like if you often forget to reply to something or tend to something, it will highlight that. It’s a really good way in your email marketing to actually get in front of people and get them engaged with your content.

– [Craig] This is really good, and I agree with you. ‘Cause people’s behavior is like, aw look, I just didn’t have time there, so it just flew by and so I didn’t, it’ll end up getting put in some folder anyway, and I just didn’t have time to check my subfolders and do all those things. And I think this is a much better process than initially putting time into AB testing, you know how people will say, “Oh we got to AB test subject clients, oh we got to AB test when we send” the things like that, I feel most sure with a large enough number of recipients, you can probably statistically get some confidence in the best time of the best subject line, but part of me just thinks, well, no. Everyone’s different, and something was happening that day, they just didn’t get to open it. So resend it, and so they get it another time, and maybe it’s a different subject line, but chances are it’s not because the subject line changed that they opened it, it’s the fact that you sent it at a different time, and that time they just did have time to open it. So– I guess my point is, do these resends rather sweating, you know the subject line, um so much as well because I think the numbers speak for themselves. Like, in fact, don’t change the subject line when you resend it, and you still get this big open rate from people who didn’t open it the first time. So it kind of proves that it wasn’t the subject line that was the problem, it was just they happened to be doing, people have lives, who knew?

– [Ian] Yeah, and another thing I do try is if um, say maybe, we do a second time and we then try a third time, we so again, create another list to offer that second email of the people who received it but didn’t open it. My third attempt is actually sending out plain text email to that unopened list, and then getting a further open rate.

– [Craig] Alright, so what do you think is the benefit of plain text?

– [Ian] I just find sometimes it gets through so it might not be marked as marketing–

– [Craig] Oh, really?

– [Ian] So, really deliver abilities changes.

– [Craig] Okay, I’d like to see some stats around that because–

– [Ian] Let’s test and measure that, Craig.

– [Craig] Yeah, we’ll test and measure that. So, you’d have to do two different emails. One normal, and one plain text. Same subject lines, sent at the same times, to a large enough size to check, yeah, I’d love to see that.

– [Ian] Alright, I did want to want to highlight one other thing, is um, one of our favorite email newsletters, Morning Brew. Which, I read this morning, and this is something I’d talk about last time, they start off the email by saying, “Good morning,” you know, “We hope you are staying warm during this icy weather,” because you know, it’s obviously getting icy in the US, sometimes email spam filters leave newsletters out in cold, right? A+ transition. Uh, “to make sure the brew is heating your inboxes everyday, please make sure you move us to your primary inbox if you use Gmail, add us to your VIP list if you use apple mail, add us to your favorites if you use outlook, or some combination of the above, if you use anything else. Thanks.” This clearly demonstrates to me that people are being affected as email programs start to funnel, and decipher what’s going on, the fact that one of our favorite newsletters that we read everyday is saying this would indicate to me that something is changing.

– [Craig] I think whenever I read those things, I’m kind of like, I just get a bit disappointed because Morning Brew, I think they’ve got more than a million people on their daily email list, so very popular, very eager, audience. And even they’re having problems with it, so it makes me kind of think like oh. How can we possibly expect to, and so yeah, if they’re saying “move to inbox,” well, I guess we could ask people to do that, but it it just highlights it’s a problem. People are busy, too many things.

– [Ian] That’s right. Alright, Craig, inside of the week, being a better version of ourselves.

– [Craig] Oh, look I read a blog post about that which I’ve uh linked to, I just wanted to mention this, it came up in conversation, I often say to the clients, when we’re kind of doing coaching, marketing coaching, two things; one, people want to be better versions of themselves, that’s why they buy. They buy something because they want to be a better version of themselves. But, likewise, we want to be better marketers. And so, part of my job, I feel as you’re paying me to do marketing, coach, and train you, is to make you a better version of yourself as a marketer. Just as I have a coach for our business, and I want to be a better version of myself as a business owner, Et cetera, et cetera, so you get the idea. And here’s the inside around it, being a better version of yourself is an incremental process. So as marketers, it’s about incremental improvement. So everyday, well, not everyday, but, regularly, you should be trying to do a little piece of your job a little bit better. And the reason I’m saying this to people is because they get swayed by these rockstars, you know the rockstar Ninja marketer, that we’re seeing so much out there, and it’s just rubbish most of the time, but even if we look at some– Say Gary Vaynerchuk, and you see his big impact, and you’re kind of like, “Ah, we’ve got to be making a big impact,” and it’s like, no, just continue incremental improvement as a marketer is all you need to do. Because that compounds, and you’ll get better and better over time, it just compounds making you a better- to be a better version of yourself as a marketer, that’s what you should strive for. Compare yourself to yourself yesterday, not to Gary Vaynerchuk, or whoever.

– [Ian] Well said, Craig. Alright, podcast of the week, Craig: Marketing From The Trenches.

– [Craig] Shout out to our mate, Will Wang from Growth Labz and his podcast. I was listening to him this morning, he was reviewing a guy on Facebook, yeah. That’s a good takeaways.

– [Ian] Encourage you guys to listen to that. Alright, and we go to resource of the week. Basecamp released a free, personal version.

– [Craig] Have you ever used Basecamp?

– [Ian] I did, back in the day.

– [Craig] Yeah, I did back in the day. We don’t use it for our agency, but I did love it as a user experience.

– [Ian] I am actually using it for a client now, because they use it with somebody else, so.

– [Craig] Well, it’s a really good tool. I liked it, I liked the experience. Well, the reason it is resource of the week is they’ve just announced a premium tier, well it’s not even premium, it’s free.

– [Ian] It’s free for freelancers.

– [Craig] Well, you get three projects.

– [Ian] You get three projects, there you go.

– [Craig] Anyone can use it, three projects, and they actually did try– One of the co-founders, he actually, on Twitter, because I follow him on Twitter, is just basically saying, “You know, we’re just giving this a go. We might lose out, it might not work. You know, we’re not a huge VC backed thing with tons of cash to, you know, burn our way to that. We’re going to give it a go and see if it works, we hope people like the experience and then in their companies, upgrade to use a paid version.” This is what we’re doing, right? So try it out, because you know, I really like what they stand for, and I really like the product, um, I think they are a bit of an outlier in success.

– [Ian] They are.

– [Craig] So a lot of people are like, “Oh, I just want to adopt the Basecamp way.” I’ve read their books and I love their books. But, I’m just like, you know, I think you’re an outlier, this doesn’t work for everyone. You’re the exception to row, and good on you guys because you’re always really smart. But yeah, it’s almost like survivor. Survivor bias, but yeah, great tool.

– [Ian] And now onto our quote of the week, Craig. From Henry Ford, “Coming together is a beginning, staying together is progress, and working together is success.” There you have it.

– [Craig] I, I can’t say anything. I can’t add to that. That’s excellent.

– [Ian] Well, you know what, after our week, so for those of you who didn’t know, we’ve had some pretty bad fires in Australia, uh, bush fires, and there have been lots of great volunteer firefighters fighting bush fires and you know, you see people come together for more sense of communities–

– [Craig] Yeah, shed purpose.

– [Ian] Shed purpose, so. Yeah, thank you to our fireys out there.

– [Craig] Amazing job, yeah. Just wonderful.

– [Ian] Well, Craig, there are some other things to share, we’d love you to leave us a review, on our podcast.

– [Craig] Connect with us on LinkedIn, too.

– [Ian] Yes, connect with us on LinkedIn, that would be fantastic. And until the next episode!

– [Craig] Catch you later, Ian!

– [Ian] See you, Craig!

– [Craig] And remember to use snippets!

– [Ian] Yes, that’s right!

– [Craig] Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of HubShots. For shownotes, and the latest news and tips, please visit us at HubShots.com

Episode 182

Episode 182: Landing Pages in HubSpot Starter

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about HubSpot’s Landing Page options in HubSpot Starter

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/182-landing-pages-in-hubspot-starter/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

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Recorded: 05 November 2019 | Published: 13 December 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

TL;DW => Too long, didn’t watch


HubSpot and Canva


HubSpot and PieSync



Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Landing pages in HubSpot Starter


hubspot starter has landing pages


The things I really like are:

  • very simple to use (similar user experience to their Drag and Drop email builder)
  • good (although small) set of initial templates to use
  • adding domain details is easy
  • landing pages are SSL enabled
  • you can just use the temp HubSpot domain to publish your landing pages (note, by default it won’t force to https, so make sure you enable this in Settings – see screenshot below)
  • reports are included (ie the simple overview of the page analytics)
  • simple checkbox for adding Google Analytics (and bizarrely, AdRoll – likely a legacy carryover)
  • the Cookies setting (part of Settings) will automatically flow to your landing pages as well
  • good overview training lesson on HubSpot Academy
  • simple to add Featured image on the page
  • has the nice Optimisation review feature
  • you can use HubSpot’s Ads option to insert Facebook, LinkedIn and Google tracking pixels into the pages (see down below in The Hurdles for some side effects of this)


Some things I’ve been struggling with:

  • UPDATE: This is now available (was updated as part of a release after we had recorded the episode): some styling issues with form labels (I can edit them on the form, but when a form is added to the landing page it inherits landing page styles, and I can’t work out how to edit form labels) – for example I wanted to change the form labels to white (from black) as I had added a dark background image behind the form – I couldn’t work out how to do this…
  • can’t edit <head> properties such as adding a noindex tag on a Thank you page (ideally we want to exclude Thank you pages from getting indexed in Google and Bing)
  • you can’t add any Landing page reports to the main dashboard – I was expecting similar options to Email reports (which you can add to the main dashboard). You can see basic landing page details on a page by page basis though (which is good)


Some things that are frustrations for me:

  • can’t add other tracking scripts to the pages eg our standard is to add Google Tag Manager (GTM) to all pages, so we can insert other tracking scripts such as Google Analytics Link and Form events, as well as social tracking such as LinkedIn Insights tag and Facebook pixels
  • One possible option: add a Rich Text module to the page and add the GTM script in there, but this may not be reliable
  • However, as mentioned earlier, you can work around the social pixels to some extent by using the Ads feature in HubSpot to add pixels in Settings (however this will be limited to Google, FB and LI, you can’t add others eg Twitter, Pinterest). Note these pixels will be added via HubSpot’s tracking code – you won’t see them inserted into the source code on the page
  • There is a side effect of this however, since if you elect to add FB, LI pixels via HubSpot’s tracking code it will do it for all instances of where the tracking code is added eg if you have a main site (using WordPress for example) and you have the tracking code there, it will be adding the LI, FB pixels there as well (which is problematic if you were using GTM to add it – since they will now be doubling up)
  • Ideally I’d love HubSpot to add a simple tickbox that adds Google Tag Manager to their sites (ie similar to their Google Analytics tickbox – it’s kinda strange they haven’t done this yet).

hubspot starter landing pages

hubspot starter landing page templates

hubspot starter ssl settings

hubspot starter site integrations

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week



Shot 4: HubSpot Extra of the Week

E-signature now available in HubSpot Sales Professional

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Fake likes and followers

It’s now illegal to sell fake followers and likes


Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Twitter bans political ads


There is now pressure on Facebook to do the same.

Conflict when advertising on Facebook

Listen to our discussion in episode 151 where we considered advertising on cigarette packs:


Craig’s internal conflict continues to grow: pushing money into platforms to get results for our clients, but on platforms that we are increasingly uncomfortable with.

Pay to play is almost mandatory for most businesses. As Scott Galloway notes in a recent episode of Pivot – this essentially makes it a tax. Something that most businesses can’t avoid.

But can you avoid using paid social. For most businesses, you can’t.

Shot 7: Podcast of the Week

Derek Sivers Podcast

Shot 8: Resource of the Week

HubSpot chats about Adaptive Testing


Shot 9: Quote of the Week

From James Clear on Twitter: https://twitter.com/jamesclear/status/1190779178574123013?s=12

Needless commitments are more wasteful than needless possessions.

Possessions can be ignored, but commitments are a recurring debt that must be paid for with your time and attention.

“The price of anything is the amount of life you exchange for it.”

—Henry David Thoreau

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.
Episode 182: Landing Pages in HubSpot Starter

– [Ian] Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 182. In this episode, we chat about HubSpot’s landing page options in HubSpot Starter, plus much more goodness on this, very special, Melbourne Cup Day in Australia. You’re listening to HubShots, Asia Pacific’s number one HubSpot focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks, features and strategies for growing your sales and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you, Craig?

– [Craig] Yeah, well like you said, it’s been quite a day.

– [Ian] We watched the race that stopped the nation, didn’t we?

– [Craig] The race that stops the nation. So if you’re in Australia, of course, you understand what this malarkey is.

– [Craig] Hello to Charles. I’m sure he was having a holiday.

– [Craig] Oh yeah he were, oh how you going Charles? But yeah, for overseas listeners, they’re probably thinking what is this Melbourne Cup? Seriously folks, people stop all around the country to watch a bunch of horses run around a track, and a lot of money I think is gambled and spent and all kinds of things. So anyway, there was a bit of a Melbourne Cup do here in the office. You came over and we caught up, and there was lots of cupcakes too, so, well–

– [Ian] They were good cupcakes!

– [Craig] There were some positives, yeah.

– [Ian] And you know what, I reckon most businesses stopped at lunchtime, so there you have it.

– [Craig] Well that’s right. A lot of people just stop at lunchtime and then they go out drinking all afternoon and night, but no, dear listeners, we are here recording HubShots for your listening pleasure.

– [Ian] All right Craig, so onto our growth thought of the week.

– [Craig] Actually growth thoughts of the week. Before we get to the TLDW, but did you see the news? There’s two items of news related to HubSpot,

– Yes!

– And it’s all over LinkedIn. Have they got a coordinated kind of, does someone, does Brian and Dharmesh, do they just send out a company-wide email, hey, we’re gonna make an announcement, would everyone please share this on LinkedIn. Anyway, as I’m sure they do, and we’ll grow on them ’cause it’s very effective, can’t miss this. So there are two announcements. We’re not actually gonna go into them in this episode, but we just will acknowledge that they were announced.

– [Ian] The first one being HubSpot acquiring PieSync.

– [Craig] So I think PieSync is almost like Zapier,

– Correct.

– But very contact-centric.

– [Ian] Yeah, and then the other news of bit of an integration with Canva. So for graphic design, I don’t know what that looks like yet.

– I saw a–

– A button. A button, the Canva button.

– [Ian] The Canva button.

– [Craig] So we’ll chat about those in upcoming episodes. But yeah, just worth acknowledging them here.

– [Ian] Well you know that, that promotion about having your email in HubSpot CRM? Remember that HubSpot did, when they released free email in setup.

– Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

– [Ian] It was such a success on LinkedIn that we’re following suit here, Craig.

– [Craig] Yeah, look it’s worth it. We kind of have these, this idea of pods, where you’d have a group of people and you all get in and share something on social, and everyone else jumps on to share it–

– That’s right.

– and like it and prop it up. It’s like, HubSpot, they’re the masters at it. Well done.

– [Ian] I’m sure there’s a lesson coming very soon. All right, so tell me about TLDW, Craig.

– [Craig] Well had you heard of this, TLDW?

– [Ian] Not until I read the show notes.

– [Craig] You’ve probably heard of TLDR, which is too long, didn’t read. Well apparently lots of people had TLDW, which is too long, didn’t watch, and it’s what people put in comments when someone posts a video that is far too boring and long to watch. People just replying with TLDW, you know, it’s kinda like, just sum it up for me in a sentence, I couldn’t be bothered watching your video. It’s like, yeah, that’s becoming more common.

– [Ian] So what’s the tip, Craig?

– [Craig] Well the tip–

– [Ian] Make a good summary at the start?

– [Craig] Well, yeah, I guess, keep it short and punchy and don’t just assume because you’re using the video format that people will watch. I guess there are other things. Always use captions and that as well, as we know on social, but it’s really just about making sure the content is actually good. There’s been such a push for video, right? Oh everyone’s video, video. So people are pumping out these boring as all something videos, and people aren’t watching them. So yeah, TLDW, there you go, something to add to your acronym list.

– [Ian] All right Craig, on HubSpot marketing feature of the week, and this is to do with landing pages in HubSpot Starter.

– [Craig] Yes, so this came out, just on Sunday, but we’re recording on the fifth of November, Melbourne Cup Day, by the way, did we mention that? Yeah. Anyway, so this has been out for a couple of days, and so I’ve put together just a few of my thoughts on it. You’ve had a chance to play with it as well.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] We will dive into this deeper as we use it more on our client sites, but yeah, I thought we’d just kinda summarize kind of our takeaways so far, and this is really, it’s a cut-down version of landing pages.

– [Ian] It is.

– It’s in Starter.

– And it is very different to the normal landing page too, in terms of it’s a drag and drop, a bit like the email editor.

– [Craig] Yeah, that’s right. So, oh well, what, actually before I dive into mine, I’ve written a whole blog post around it, but what’s your kind of thoughts, what’s been your initial impressions?

– [Ian] My initial impressions are great, in the perspective of A, closing that loop of all the things that we need to get started with a business, and that’s what I liked about it. Look, I haven’t played with it as in depth as you have. You know, I read your notes and I went to discover some of the things. So we’ll go through this right now. So Craig, let’s highlight some of the good things about the landing page tool that’s in HubSpot Starter.

– [Craig] Yeah, so some of the good things, well, first of all, it’s really simple to use, as you would expect. There’s a good set of initial templates. It’s only a small selection, we’ve got screenshots in the show notes, but they’re quite good. So for example, there is ebook signup and a thank you page. There’s newsletter signup too. There’s a few of each. So that’s quite good. Adding domains is really easy, and also SSL is enabled, well it’s there by default.

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] There is a situation if you don’t use a domain but you just use the default HubSpot domain, which is you know, like that test kind of–

– [Ian] Yes, HS dot something.

– [Craig] It doesn’t apply SSL by default, so I’ve got something else on the show notes to make sure you turn that on. And you might think, well why would you do that, surely you’d have your own domain? I actually think a good option here is, there are many cases when, no, just don’t need to put your domain in, and I’m surprised by the number of times I’ve been visiting someone’s site and they go, oh here, sign up, and it fires off to–

– [Ian] Lead pages or something like that.

– Lead pages, and it’s a really ugly lead pages. People don’t care. And especially on mobile, they don’t care, or coming from social, just opens, they fill out the form. So I think there’s a very good use case here for having landing pages that just use the default HubSpot ugly URL, we’ll call it, as opposed to a domain. And there is simple reporting. So you see the landing page, and you get a per landing page report.

– [Ian] You know one thing I did like? The optimizations review. So have you got the title correctly and so on. I really thought that was good, like it’s–

– I think that is good too.

– [Ian] Hitting on the things that we need to be looking at.

– [Craig] Yeah, also you know, there’s some nice things, like, you know the cookies setting?

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] You can put in, in settings you go cookies. Yep, that follows through. So even if you’ve got it on your own website, it’ll follow through on landing pages. They have a great little HubSpot Academy overview on it. Like this is well, you know, this is a polished release. I guess they flagged it at Inbound, so they’ve had a bit of time to make sure it’s there. And also, like simple things, like a featured image is part of the settings there. So if you’re sharing the landing page on social, featured image’ll come through. And then also, because they’ve got the HubSpot ads add-on, well, like an ad, it’s–

– [Ian] Well, mini add-on.

– [Craig] Mini add-on, yeah. Well it’s the ads feature.

– [Ian] It’s ads feature within the tool.

– [Craig] Which you can get in Starter and that will actually work with it as well. So part of that is, it can insert pixels, like Facebook Pixel, Google Pixel, LinkedIn Pixel–

– Very important.

– And that’ll work in this landing page as well. Now that does have a bit of a gotcha, which I’ll get to next, but yeah, lots of good things here, and for many people, many small businesses especially–

– [Ian] Great place to start.

– [Craig] This is a no brainer. If you’ve got Marketing Starter, it’s like, well, just get these landing pages going.

– [Ian] Great. All right, so let’s talk about couple of the average things, Craig, that you’ve been struggling with.

– [Craig] Okay, so I’ve been struggling with some of the styling. I’ll give you an example. Form labels. I can’t actually work out how to style those on the landing page. You’ll style them on the form, right, and if you were to use that form on say a WordPress site, it would carry the styling over, but when you use that HubSpot form on the HubSpot landing page, it inherits the styling from the landing page. Now on the landing page itself, I can’t work out actually how to set the styles of the labels on the forms. So I’ll give you an example. They’re by default white, but then on the page, I actually don’t have a screenshot here in the show notes, but one of the ones I was working on for a client, we had a dark background, so I was making all the font white so it stands out, but I couldn’t get it on the form fields, so they’re all black. Now part of me says there’s something obvious I’m missing, that this is just an issue I’ve only been playing with a couple of days so maybe I’ve missed it, but if I’ve missed it, then well, you know, it’s easy to miss, I guess. Maybe it’s really obvious and I missed it, but that was a challenge. You can’t edit it head properties to put meta tags in. So our standard use case on a thank you page is always to put a noindex meta tag, ’cause you don’t want Google indexing your thank you pages.

– Correct. That’s right.

– Especially if it’s got a download, things like that. I can’t see any way to add that to the head section of a page.

– [Ian] That should probably be an option that’s someone has to tick, right. Don’t wanna noindex this.

– [Craig] That would be better. That would be better, yeah. And the other thing, you can’t actually add, there’s no widget, report widgets for adding landing pages to the main dashboard.

– [Ian] Oh!

– [Craig] Yeah, now I was expecting there would be, because even with the email, you know how you can set–

– Yes, it has the email, yes.

– [Craig] There’s some email widgets, well they’re called reports, but let’s call them widgets, to add to the main dashboard. You can do that for email, you can’t do it for landing pages. I don’t know if it’s coming, or it’s not there yet, but I couldn’t see where.

– Yeah right.

– [Craig] I kind of expected that, ’cause on your dashboard this makes it complete, right?

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] Main dashboard okay, sure,

– I want to see it.

– it’s all cut down, I just want to see contacts, yep, bit of deal information, here’s email information, landing page information. It seemed kind of obvious, but, well look, you’re getting this for free, right, so who am I to complain, but I kind of expected to see that.

– [Ian] All right. Now, some of the things we need to jump over, Craig. Firstly being tracking. So often, like when we’re working, we put in a Google Tag Manager tracking code so we can add tracking in there, and we are unable to do this in Starter.

– Yeah, I find this really frustrating, and in some ways it’s a showstopper for me for most of our clients, because our standard kit is Google Tag Manager, set up all the pixels, everything’s–

– Correct.

– Inserted by Google Tag–

– And it’s easily manageable.

– [Craig] Yeah, and that includes inserting on landing pages. Now, I think for many businesses, maybe they don’t, this isn’t the use case they need, so maybe it’s not a concern for them, but it’s becoming the standard, Google Tag Manager. And so HubSpot, they do have the checkbox, Add Google Analytics, and there are workarounds about how you can get the pixels in using the ads.

– Correct, yep.

– [Craig] Settings, but I just want a little, I just wanna be able to add Google Tag Manager to these landing pages, and I couldn’t work out how to do it. I don’t think you can do it. I know you contacted Support

– I did.

– And they came, and what did they came up with a slight, or a suggestion.

– [Ian] Yeah, they just said to use a rich text module and put the code in there, and it won’t necessarily insert it at the right spot, but they pointed me to an article which I’ll dig out, which people said you know, what happens if you do insert the Tag Manager code, not in the head, but in the body somewhere? It’s our future.

– I haven’t actually had a chance to test that yet,

– Neither have I.

– And that might be the workaround, that might work for us, but still–

– [Ian] Can we please have it? I just wanna–

– [Craig] In fact, for HubSpot, I just want a tickbox that just says, Insert Google Tag Manager, and you just put the Tag Manager code.

– That’s right. It should be, yeah.

– [Craig] That’s what I want. But that’s pretty much my hurdles. Overall, I think it’s very compelling.

– [Ian] It is very compelling.

– [Craig] It’s such a good addition. I think for many businesses, this negates the need for a third party landing page tool.

– [Ian] That’s right.

– [Craig] Plus, until we get this Google Tag Manager piece sorted, maybe we’ll still continue to use it, but I’d love to get rid of all those other tools and just reduce our marketing stack even further.

– [Ian] Yes, agreed.

– [Craig] We’re 90% there, this is so close, and yeah, well done, HubSpot, really impressed.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, onto HubSpot sales feature of the week, and this is to do with CRM customizations. It says that we’ve been waiting for. This applies to Professional and Enterprise, and this gives you the ability on the contact record to customize what you can see on the contact records on those left and right columns.

– [Craig] Now you’ve got this on, I haven’t actually tried this yet, and we did flag this a couple of episodes ago, didn’t we, when we saw the announcement.

– [Ian] Yes, at recording this episode, you can opt in for it, and on the 11th of November, I think it rolls out to everybody.

– [Craig] Okay, cool. So this is–

– [Ian] So, to be honest, I haven’t played with it fully. I’ve read some of the documentation about it, and I’ve actually gone in. So I’ll tell you one thing I did try to do, ’cause I’ve had customers ask me, like, “We’re not using a service partner. “Can I just delete that off there?” So I actually went into this customer’s account and tried it. You can’t delete things out of there. So you can’t delete like the entire service widget, for example. That will remain there. I can go in and change what’s on it, but obviously if I’m not using it, who cares? So just be aware of that. I thought maybe I’d be able to get rid of a whole widget, but I can’t.

– [Craig] That’s really interesting. So what do you do, you just push it down the bottom right, out of the way?

– [Ian] No, oh yeah I guess you would.

– You can reorder them.

– [Ian] You would reorder them, correct.

– [Craig] But this will become a problem, especially with they’re becoming a platform. Did you know they’re a platform now, Ian?

– [Ian] Yes, I did. We are a platform company, Craig.

– [Craig] So basically you’re gonna have more and more of these integrations, that’s my point, so–

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] Your sidebars are gonna get very crowded. I guess this new customizing layout is a step in that direction, where you will actually be able to hide them altogether. I would imagine that’s coming down the track.

– [Ian] Exactly, and I think that’s what we would want to see to make life easier. All right Craig, we’ve got the Go the Extra of the week, and that is e-signatures being available in HubSpot Sales Professional. So we tried this out.

– [Craig] I must say that was a very good experience.

– [Ian] It is, isn’t it?

– [Craig] Yeah, it was very slick and seamless. And good on HubSpot for this, because I feel in the past they’ve released some stuff and I’ve felt, oh this wasn’t quite ready, they’ve rushed this out.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] This is not one of them. And lately, and well, we’ve just talked about landing pages.

– Well this has been in Enterprise. This has been in Enterprise. Has been rolled down into Professional.

– Oh, is it the exact same Enterprise functionality?

– It’s exactly the same Enterprise functionality.

– Oh, oh well that would explain it, right. Actually I thought they had brought it down and actually limited a bit, but no totally–

– No, it’s just been brought down from Enterprise into Professional. So this is a feature that’s been there in HubSpot Enterprise for well over a year, I think.

– [Craig] Okay, well no wonder it’s so seamless, then. ‘Cause it’s really good, isn’t it?

– [Ian] Yes, and it is powered by HelloSign, just so you’re aware. That’s how it happens, and so we did a test internally to ourselves, and there was an interesting feature in there about countersigning, right. So that was actually being able to choose who had to countersign that quote, and it was a great experience. You did the signature on your desktop, trying to use a mouse. That was very, very tactful.

– [Craig] Oh yeah, and that was a beautiful signature I applied.

– It was. And then I actually used the feature in there where you could actually take a picture of your signature on your phone, and you could email that picture into HelloSign, and it was waiting for it because it had a unique ID in the subject, and then it picked it up and you could edit it or cut it up, rotate it, et cetera, clean it up, and then add it to the, as your signature, which I thought was fantastic.

– [Craig] All right, so one of the things I liked is how when I went to sign, it made me verify my identity by sending me an email, which I had to then verify.

– Correct.

– [Craig] Was that a setting that you chose, or that’s just–

– No, that is the standard mode of operation.

– [Craig] Okay, well the reason I ask, ’cause I’ve signed plenty of things that were HelloSign enabled forms, and I’ve never had that before. So I was wondering if that was a new–

– [Ian] So I suspect that is a default setting that they’ve enabled. I was really impressed with that, and I think it’s something that we’re just gonna keep using more and more. Get those signatures on there, Craig. And again, so people have asked me this before, once people have accepted the quote, are they able to download it or is it a web-based only quote? There is an option to print, and there is an option to download it as a PDF.

– [Craig] Yeah, and the download includes the full history and everything.

– [Ian] It does, it gives you the IP addresses of when you signed it and what time, and the IP address mark. All right, marketing tip of the week, Craig.

– [Craig] Did you know it’s illegal to sell fake follows and likes? So there’s always been this problem in the industry of buying likes, buying followers.

– [Ian] It’s like buying friends, isn’t it Craig?

– [Craig] It’s well, it’s buying friends

– I’m joking.

– That you don’t actually know. And everyone kind of frowns on it and says they don’t do it, and of course, everyone does it. I’m talking about US politicians and things like that, right.

– Yes.

– [Craig] Okay, so we’ve all known about this, well now it’s actually illegal. So it’s not as though it’s just frowned upon and people get called out about it. It’s actually illegal.

– [Ian] Yes, so the FTC has ruled, ruled this.

– Which is a good thing, and I think, I think this is a good sign, I’m assuming this will go to other countries as well. But yeah, just a sign of the times, I think, when something becomes that problematic that there needs to be government–

– Stepping in.

– Intervention to make it illegal, I think that’s interesting. I’d love to see some of the court cases that come out when people will be charged and this will be tested and things like that. But just another, I guess sign that authenticity is not only the way you should go, but it is almost, yeah, criminal ramifications if you don’t.

– [Ian] Yeah, and look, I’ll say this from a perspective, I’ve had a few people come to me and say, “Hey look, we’ve got heaps of, we’re working with someone, “we’ve got heaps of followers on Instagram, for example, “but we don’t seem to get much engagement.” And then when you dig a little bit further, you find that they’ve actually bought followers and likes, and therefore, they’re not engaged. Like, they’re just not real people.

– [Craig] Well there’s this whole argument to be made for it around social proof. And I’ll happily admit, I’ve tested this way back when it started years ago. I was buying thousands of fans and likes on accounts. I was just testing it to see how it goes, and definitely there was a social proof element there, and of course they had no engagement or anything like that, so totally worthless, wasn’t even driving traffic, completely fake, but it certainly gives the appearance of credibility. If you were only doing fake likes and fake followers, sure, it’s very obvious. But when you blend it in with actually a real community, you’re basically accelerating or giving the appearance of accelerated growth. So that’s the way it could have been used I guess well–

– In conjunction.

– [Craig] Yeah, and so the fact that they’re ruling that out and well, you know, any form of that is now illegal, I think that’s a good thing. In our next you know, shot, we’re gonna talk about the general, I guess side effects of social overall, but yeah, I think this is just the way, it’s all around authenticity. You’ve really gotta aim for that now.

– [Ian] All right, which leads us onto our insight of the week, Craig. Twitter bans political ads.

– [Craig] All right, so this was big news last week that Twitter is banning all kinds of political advertising from I think it’s later in November, like 22nd of November onwards. So this puts a lot of pressure, and the reason this was such good timing from Twitter, well done, masterfully played, was because Facebook is under a lot of fire for this lately, and I think it was just into the Facebook earnings call when Twitter announced it. It’s just gold, it’s just, anyway.

– [Ian] And we’ve got elections coming up next year.

– [Craig] Yeah, well that’s right. And so now the pressure’s on Facebook. Will they do it and well, let’s assume they do, I kind of, well I don’t know.

– [Ian] Kind of feel like they’re gonna follow, right?

– [Craig] They kinda have to in some ways, but money speaks louder than words, and their earnings call has shown massive increase, so advertisers don’t care, right, people don’t seem to care. You know, who knows what’s gonna happen. Anyway, it just raised for me, this idea again, of as an agency, and as a marketer, and perhaps listeners as marketers, and well other agencies, how do you feel about putting money into a platform, I’m thinking mainly of Facebook, but applies to all the social platforms, especially applies to Google, giving them money, okay, to drive results for your clients, on a platform that you are increasingly uncomfortable with? And I’m increasingly uncomfortable with Facebook, and back in episode 151, which was a while ago, we actually discussed this idea of would you advertise on cigarette packs?

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] And I was kinda being overly dramatic at the time, but I kind of feel the example still holds, a very addictive and potentially harmful product that you advertise on to get results for your clients, and so I have this ongoing conflict, and I think the reason I mention it is because I know other marketers, this is nagging or niggling at them. And I think we’re gonna see some kind of change in behavior with many marketers maybe rethinking how they spend their dollars, and I’m actually rethinking our agency, how we position our agency. I actually wanna pull back from doing paid, we do so much paid advertising for our clients, because it gets such good results, right. You can’t deny that, it’s pay to–

– Absolutely.

– It’s pay to play, you have to do it, right. And I know there are a few companies, Databox is one, that hasn’t done any paid, and well they’ve done a very strong content plan, but I kinda feel like, well, imagine if they’d done paid, they would have grown heaps better, I don’t know, you know, I can’t say they’ve been very successful, but there will be exceptions to the rule, but as a general, most companies, they have to pay to play. They have to pay Facebook, and they get results, and so I’m increasingly uncomfortable with it, so I’m like, how do I do this as an agency and perhaps listeners, as a marketer, how do you do this and feel right about it?

– [Ian] So that’s interesting thing, Craig. So how does that differ from say people that used to pay 10s or 100s of 1000s of dollars to Yellow Pages to advertise their business, or did that on TV?

– [Craig] Well, I think it’s the difference between the users, because there’s a case, a strong case to be made, that particular platforms, Facebook, Google, are harmful in the sense that they’re addictive, and they also propagate information in a bubble that might just reinforce biases that are not helpful, and could be therefore harmful to others that are excluded or biased against, discriminated, et cetera. I don’t wanna go into that here. Let’s just assume that that’s possible and that’s true. If that is, do I wanna be part of that platform? Now, Yellow Pages, not addictive, not harmful. Extortionate, maybe.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] And other avenues. Even television, you could say is some ways–

– [Ian] Possibly addictive.

– [Craig] Possibly addictive, but quite highly regulated, well especially in Australia.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] And there are codes of conduct

– Correct.

– And all those kinds of things. I’m not sure of the case in other countries, maybe the US is more lax, but certainly in European countries there’s a lot more regulation around what can be shown and–

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] There’s almost a protection of the people. So I feel it’s different, and I feel the social platforms are different. So that’s probably my response to there, and so it does need greater thought and oversight, and ultimately we’re putting money in, we’re giving money to them, and you know, I’m a Facebook shareholder. I stand to gain from this as well, so, anyway, my point is, I’m conflicted, and the reason I’m raising it on the show, and will continue to raise it, is ’cause I think a lot of marketers are becoming conflicted about this. It needs more discussion.

– [Ian] Now there was an interesting podcast on, was it Recode?

– [Craig] Oh Rec, Pivot.

– [Ian] Pivot, sorry.

– [Craig] Yeah, with who–

– [Ian] With Scott Galloway actually was talking about this, and we listened to it together. It was really interesting. He said it was pay to play was almost like a mandatory tax on businesses, which I thought was really interesting.

– [Craig] Yeah, well when you have to do it, and there’s no other choice but pay to play, it’s not just differentiation then. It’s a tax. It’s a tax on small business, especially. I don’t know what my takeaway there is, except to say I think we need to be discussing this more. As marketers, we need to be thoughtful marketers.

– [Ian] Correct. I agree with that. Definitely, think about being thoughtful towards your audience. All right Craig, our podcast of the week? It is the Derek Sivers podcast. And this is a little book that you gave me, which I think was a book that we had on one of the previous shows and we had a quote out of it, but you gave it to me, and it was really interesting. I read it on the way home on the train, and then, was just one of those books where I was like, I actually couldn’t put it down. I actually read it through and finished it that night because it was so good.

– [Craig] It was so good. I’m just seeing it on the bookshelf there, yes. It was called “Anything You Want”, I think. And he started CD Baby, didn’t he?

– [Ian] Yes he did. And you know what? It’s really interesting, his podcast. So he sent an email out the other day, I got it and I’m like, oh cool. I listen to it, his podcasts are every day, and they last between one and three minutes. Just a little thought, and so I’ve just gone through and listened to them all.

– [Craig] He’s the Seth Godin of podcasting.

– [Ian] That’s right! But anyway, what I wanted to say was, there’s some really good things in there, and it doesn’t take long to listen to it, and I wanted to highlight, because he is somebody that has actually, I would actually recommend reading the book firstly. When you’ve read the book and then you listen to his podcast, you kind of, I think it makes a bit more sense, because you can understand where he’s coming from, as opposed to just listening to that thought and going, oh, really, does this guy have any idea? But I think it’s really thought provoking, and I loved it, so that’s why I wanna recommend it on the show. All right, we haven’t, the resource of the week, Craig, and this is to do with adaptive testing.

– [Craig] Yeah, so look, we’re coming up to time, we can’t dive into this, but it’s a blog post on the HubSpot blog, and really what they’ve tried–

– You know what it says? AB testing is dead.

– [Craig] They’ve basically said, oh adaptive testing, which is really just multivariate testing with multiple versions of pages. So it’s like ABCD testing.

– [Ian] Exactly.

– [Craig] And they call it adaptive testing.

– [Ian] Because there’s machine learning involved, right?

– [Craig] Well… Like this is not a new concept, but they’re trying to own the term. Where there’s lots of AI put into multivariate testing and things. They do make some good points in the post,

– It does.

– So go and read it, but yeah.

– [Ian] Yeah, and look, if you’re a marketer, I think you’ve got to understand that this is available, and this available now in Enterprise within your portal if you’re an Enterprise user. If you’ve got Professional, you’re not gonna see that. You’ve still got AB testing, which is dead. So I’d definitely be using that, because I think even that is under-utilized, but be aware that this is available to you, and you know, there are people that would be using this, not necessarily on the platform, but using other tools that might actually have it, and I think it’s really important to have an understanding of what that is.

– [Craig] Do you remember the days when one of the biggest differentiators between Marketing Pro and Marketing Enterprise–

– [Ian] Was AB testing.

– [Craig] Was AB testing.

– [Ian] I do.

– [Craig] And then, remember the day they put AB testing down into Pro, and we’re going, oh, that’s great, and well now they’re just telling us AB testing is dead. That’s progress, folks.

– [Ian] Now we’re onto adaptive, Craig, come on. Get with the program! All right, Craig, what’s that quote of the week?

– [Craig] Oh, actually, I saw this on Twitter from James Clear, and he was making a comment and then he quoted–

– [Ian] Now James Clear wrote a book, right?

– [Craig] He did, “Atomic Habits”. Great book, really good book about productive, effective productivity, I would say. Anyway, do you wanna read the quote?

– [Ian] Yeah.

– [Craig] Oh actually, there was some, his comments leading up to the quote.

– [Ian] Yeah, so it says, “Needless commitments “are more wasteful than needless possessions. “Possessions can be ignored, but commitments “are a recurring debt that must be paid for “with your time and attention.”

– [Craig] And then he quotes Henry David Thoreau, saying “The price of anything is the amount of life “you exchange for it”.

– [Ian] What can I say, Craig? After hearing the, after reading the first two and then hearing that quote, I’m like, wow.

– [Craig] What can you say? You can get off Facebook, that’s what I can…

– [Ian] Anyway, listeners, I hope you’ve enjoyed this show. We’d love it if you could share this podcast with one person that you know that would benefit from it, and also leave us a rating on Apple Podcasts, that would be fantastic. Well listeners, I hope you enjoyed this episode. Until next time–

– [Craig] Catch you later, Ian.

– [Ian] See you, Craig. Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news, including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at hubshots.com.

Episode 181

Episode 181: HubSpot Tasks, Marketing Mindset

Welcome to Episode 181 of Hubshots!

APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about HubSpot tasks, and having a mindset of openness.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/181-hubspot-tasks-marketing-mindset/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

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Recorded: Monday 28 October 2019 | Published: Friday 6 December 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

HubSpot Training continues the awesome

Training on How to be really good at marketing in 2020!

A 15-part video crash course on bringing live chat, Facebook Messenger, and bots into your inbound strategy for the first time.


The HubSpot moat widens.

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

HubL Designer Tweaks

The HubSpot Design now includes more warnings when you are potentially going to break something

Eg if you rename a custom module, it will prompt you to check dependencies

Screenshot 28 10 19  4 29 pm

You may recall we’ve highlighted the dangers of renaming assets previously (it was a Gotcha in episode 152:


Looking forward to customising our Contact sidebars (when we finally get it):


Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Using Tasks


Want to highlight the importance of using tasks in contacts, deals & tickets.

To keep things in one place and know if things are being actioned by the appropriate people.  Not to mention that you can have email reminders to notify the necessary person.

Shot 4: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

It’s a gotcha free episode!

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Opt-in to Spam field on forms


semrush form with spam optin


  • Make sure it is clearly marked
  • Make sure it is optional

Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Having a mindset of openness

Marketing is constantly changing, so you need to open to new ideas, especially if they are advice from experts.

Often this means overcoming your own biases towards things you are comfortable with, or that you feel emotionally will work, even though they may not be backed up by data.

That said, there’s a balance between doing just a few things well, versus trying everything.

So, make sure you have a ‘test and measure’ plan that is well spaced out, so you don’t run thin trying to do everything.

Some things to be open to:

  • LinkedIn versus Facebook
  • Google versus Bing
  • Instagram versus Twitter

Most companies will happily embrace the first, but not the latter.

Shot 7: App of the Week

Setting your bedtime on your iPhone.  It reminds you when to go to bed to get the rest you need and also turns off all notifications till morning!

IMG F414EFC66E3B 1

Shot 8: Resource of the Week

Ahrefs Blogging tips for beginners:


Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn’t do than by the ones you did do. So. . .sail away from the safe harbour. Explore. Dream. Discover.”

– Mark Twain

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

Aaron Wall’s take on the recent Google changes to nofollow


Interesting item of the week: BBC News launches ‘dark web’ Tor mirror


Guide to keyword research:


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 181: HubSpot Tasks, Marketing Mindset

– [Ian] Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 181. In this episode, we talk about HubSpot Tasks, and having a mindset of openness. You’re listening to HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals, who use HubSpot. It’s hosted by myself, Ian Jacob from Search and Be Found, and Craig Bailey from . How are you Craig?

– [Craig] Looks pretty good and another interesting night ahead.

– [Ian] So let’s start with our Growth Thought of the Week, Craig.

– [Craig] Look this really is HubSpot’s . We chatted about this last week, didn’t we, or in an episode or two ago. The most that they got through their training, and well, it’s a trifecta, isn’t it? Product usability, which is great, customer support, and then learning and training around it. Then, well, here’s another example, isn’t it?

– [Ian] That’s right. And this is a fifteen part video crash course they call it. And what did it say, it say, “Bringing Chat, Facebook Messenger, and Bots “into your Inbound Strategy for the First Time.” And it’s how to be really good at marketing in 2020. So I’d encourage you, I’ve just watched one or two of them, but I encourage everybody actually do take the time to do this because, I think from all the times that we’ve spoken on this podcast about how people are buying and what’s happening, I think this is a very clear indication of the channels that we need to be focusing on, coming into 2020.

– [Craig] I think that’s exactly right and coming up in Shot six we’re actually gonna be talking about mindset and having this open mindset to learning, because marketing is changing so much. So here’s a good example and jump onboard.

– [Ian] That’s right. All right, HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week, Craig.

– [Craig] Well, it’s not really a feature, but it’s an improvement. So this is when you’re in your HubSpot Designer and you’re working on a custom module. We talked about this back in Episode 152, something like that, it was a while ago. How you change the name of a variable, or perhaps a customer module, and you think, “Oh, it’s just a name, it’s a label, right?” But no, a whole lot of things broke. Well, we lamented at the time that there was no indication that was the case but, just noticed today because I was changing something it wasn’t actually used anywhere, because I was just creating a new one. But then when I did change the name, it prompted up and I got a screenshot in the show notes right, it just warns you it says, “Hang on, this might have “a whole bunch of dependencies. “You wanna check these.” And it actually makes you check a box saying, “Yeah, I confirm there’s gonna be no problem.” Before it actually continues to rename it. It’s good you know, it’s kind of saving you from yourself. Obviously, we would like it so that it would go and update those dependencies for you. But it’s no visual studio yet, but it’s getting there.

– But this is Craig.

– [Craig] a good protection mechanism. So that’s why I’m putting it in Feature of the Week because, even though it’s not a feature as such in a new feature, it’s a protection that will save you time. Don’t fall into the problems that we learn the hard way, or you especially learned the hard way at the time.

– [Ian] THat’s right, on a live site. That was rather nerve racking. And you know what, I just wanted to, this is gonna save support so much time. I think that’s right, you know what, I think sometimes their product enhancements are often just prompted by support saying, “Man, we’re getting too many tickets about this. “Can you fix this?”

– [Ian] And two turkeys on a show talking about it. All right now Craig, we’re looking forward to something coming up, and it’s the Contacts sidebar. Where we can actually rearrange and put what we want on there.

– Yeah, customize. Well, we’ve always been able to put the fields where we want, but now we can put them into groups.

– Correct.

– So that’s gonna be good. So basically having these Contact properties groups. I’m looking forward to that, but we don’t have it yet.

– [Ian] And that’s on marketing enterprise is it?

– [Craig] Pro and Enterprise. So there’s

– Yeah.

– [Craig] different things between Pro and Enterprise, thanks Laura from HubSpot for helping me out on that. But even with Pro you’ll be able to customize it. And so what we’re talking about here is basically grouping together fields and moving them into little sections. So I think it will be nice.

– [Ian] Something to look forward to.

– [Craig] Well yeah because they’ve got a knowledge base about it. They’ve got a blog post. They emailed me about it, do I have it in my portal? No.

– No.

– [Craig] I’m not quite on the Beta group for that yet.

– [Ian] All right. On to HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week, Craig. And I’m gonna highlight using Tasks, and the importance of it to be used on Contacts, Deals, Tickets, Companies, right? Why I’m saying this, I had a call during the week, and I got the call and was like, “Oh I’m trying to send this person an email. “I need to be logged against that contact, “because I need them to sort out this ticket.” And my question was, “Why are we sending emails around “to tell people what to do in Tickets?” And so I said, “We need to be using the Tasks feature “that’s within there.” So they wanted to inform someone within the team that they need to look after this support ticket. And possibly, somebody was owning the ticket but they needed somebody else from the team to do something. So I said, “Why don’t you actually create “a Task in the Ticket assigned to that person, “set the email notifications?” This is one of the criteria. How did I know that they know that they’ve got a Task, because they don’t log into HubSpot all the time. To which I said, “You can set an email reminder “at a particular date and time to remind that person “that there is a task against their name in HubSpot.” And the benefit of this is you can actually know that the person has done something about it, and then follow up with what needs to happen. Now obviously, if you’ve got professional . If something’s not attended to within a certain period, you could possibly run a workflow to check and maybe notify somebody within the organisation, which I haven’t done. But just trying to highlight to you use the tools and the systems and even use, what seems like a very simplistic tool like Tasks to get stuff done.

– [Craig] Well there are a whole bunch of options there, I’d say. But you can actually check for, you could run workflows based on last activity date and things like that. Workflows can create tasks. So you can do all of those kinds of things. There’s a lot of power there you can put in place if you wanted. That might be overkill. But I think what you’re saying is just this general item, like whenever I create a deal, and it prompts, would you like a Task, I always say yes, because I forget about them. I put the deal in. I’ve actually then remember to go back now. I’m actually like, well, a lot of users. I don’t login to HubSpot to check out my Tasks. So I do rely on that email notification coming out too.

– [Ian] You’re quite right.

– [Craig] I just leave it to HubSpot okay, yeah. You know HubSpot will remind me when I have to follow up that deal. So it’s one less thing that’s clogging up my brain.

– [Ian] Here’s a little bonus tip. There is, if you’re in Workflows, there is a contact re-engagement task set up your Workflows that you can can actually enable. But if there has been no activity on that contact within the last three days, it can set you a task to actually do something.

– [Craig] There you go.

– [Ian] All right, Craig. What’s the Gotcha of the Week?

– [Craig] I’m very pleased to say this is a gotcha-free episode. And I was racking my brain, because I don’t like,

– I was surprised.

– I don’t like to let the listeners down you know. But I always try and have a gotcha. I just couldn’t–

– You know what? You were having a lot of fun with HubDB and I thought you would find something in there.

– [Craig] Oh, HubDB is so good. The number of custom modules were in there, like our new site, which is available if you wanna go and find it. Although we’re not actually promoting it yet, because it’s still got a couple things to be flushed out. But so much of our new site is running on HubDB and Hubble. Just so much stuff like teams, all our products, services, all our certifications everything in there, and client testimonials, badges throughout the site they’re all randomized. Yeah, HubDB it’s so good. I guess I’m really enjoying HubDB and Hubble.

– [Ian] So yeah, let’s go have a look at Craig’s site, zen.com.iuxen–

– Well, it’s a www

– Www?

– Yeah, because I got a zen.com now, by a long standing WordPress one, which has been there through millennial now. But our HubSpot one yeah, is the www. I’m still frustrated that you can’t get a clean URL on HubSpot. I know there’s all kinds of technical reasons, but I just wanna be without the www.

– [Ian] Right, gotcha.

– [Craig] At the moment, well you can redirect it, they do it actually. In fact, you can redirect.

– You can redirect.

– [Craig] You can put a redirect in but I want the URL in my browser,

– [Ian] Yep.

– [Craig] to be clean, yeah.

– [Ian] Actually, you know it’s interesting, talking about clean URLs and browsers I’ve noticed in Chrome now, when you actually look at the URL when it actually goes to the site, it doesn’t show www in there. It just shows .

– [Craig] Oh it doesn’t show anything?

– If you go to copy it you will see www.

– [Craig] Yeah and actually the thing that I do like, and I don’t think they had this originally, but, so you’ve just got that clean or truncated

– Yep.

– In the address bar. Let’s say you put your cursor into the URL.

– Yes.

– Then it pre-fills it. But it gets

– Yes.

– your cursor where it should be, which I like, which it didn’t used to do. It used to be, “Ah, I’ve lost my place.” And things like that.

– [Ian] Yeah, that’s right.

– [Craig] Even little things like that, thank you Chrome, that’s something I’d expect from Apple.

– Yeah .

– But Google’s got it in Chrome. That’s very nice! So, I’m totally off track on this.

– [Ian] Thank you to the Chrome Product Team.

– What are we saying, Gotcha of the Week, There’s no Gotcha of the Week. In fact, we’ve just turned it into a craze fest for Hubble and HubDB.

– [Ian] All right, Craig. On to the Marketing Tip of the Week. This is a global marketing day. So, if you go to GlobalMarketingDay.com. This is run by SEMrush.

– [Craig] Yes. They’re putting it all together. And well then, I guess you could go and enjoy that. I think it’s on tomorrow actually, or, by the time you listen to this episode, it will be long gone. But that’s not the reason it’s in the shout outs. Because when I was registering for it, did you see this, you fill out your form they ask for your phone number by the way, to attend an online webinar, which I find quite–

– to make sure you don’t miss the start.

– I don’t know, is that what it is for? Anyway, I felt they were a bit officious with the fields they’re asking, but then at the bottom, here’s the one that got me. And it’s–

– Was that pre-filled, that you had to uncheck or?

– No, it wasn’t.

– Okay, you have to .

– You had to fill those in.

– Yeah.

– Or at least it had that but it’s just, I agreed to receive third party offers. Like, it’s a long time since I’ve seen this when signing up for something and they’re gonna sell my emails off to .

– That’s right. by selecting this checkbox, you authorize SEMrush to share your personal data with SEMrush partner for marketing purposes under the indicated forms, terms, sorry.

– [Craig] Yeah, so this is basically . Tick the opt in to get spammed. Like I know there’s co-marketing. This is, but I will say the good thing about it and this is why it’s my Marketing Tip of the Week, is that it’s optional.

– Yes.

– And so if you’re gonna put this kind of thing in your forms, especially if you’re doing co-marketing and you’ve gotta do it right and abide by, well it’s getting increasingly privacy rules and things like that not just GDPR but, anyway, make sure it’s opt in. Make sure it’s off by default. And also, make sure it’s clearly marked. So I will give SEMrush, I guess,

– Points.

– points, for the fact it was clearly marked.

– Yes.

– It wasn’t sneakily put in. But, really? Is that what we’ve come to? Sign up for some online training and I’ve gotta give them my phone number plus potentially opt in? Oh well.

– And your first child too, Craig .

– Oh that’s okay.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, on to Inside of the Week. Having a mindset of openness.

– [Craig] You know we were chatting about this before the show. Like what will we talk about as we munch down on our burgers from the Orchard. Hey, that’s a new burger place in Chatsford, by the way. So what what’s your rating of the burgers at the Orchard, eh?

– [Ian] Oh I don’t know. I’ll give it a five, Craig.

– [Craig] Yeah, it wasn’t a patch from Burger Patch was it?

– No.

– Burger Patch in Chatsford, that’s the place for burgers. Yep, go the extra.

– [Ian] That’s right.

– [Craig] Yeah, hey by the way. this one’s for you Mets. Looking forward to that next ketchup. Anyway, back to the point. Openness. So we’re chatting about this over dinner before the show, chatting about mindset and this topic came up, didn’t it?

– [Ian] Yeah, absolutely. And I wanted to highlight these speakers I have conversations with people every day about trying new things. One of the things over time that I have learned, is to have set aside some budget to actually test and experiment. So, a usual thing is that we’d have about, we’d work up to about a 20% budget to experiment with new stuff.

– [Craig] Oh wow, 20% that’s actually high.

– It’s high, yeah.

– I would have said 10%. Yeah.

– [Ian] So that’s something I’m gearing up, I’m not saying we’re at 20%, but it’s the place I’d like to be. And what it showed me is that people have preconceived ideas about things even if they haven’t tried it. And because, you know I spoke to Craig and he said this, and I have to do this and I’m forgetting about Facebook, that’s rubbish, you know? Like who would use Facebook, honestly?

– Is that a typical response you get, people are just not open to using Facebook?

– [Ian] Correct, don’t wanna use Facebook. Like who’s gonna be on there, tell me. So, not that I was struggling with this, but I had basically demonstrated somebody, look we’re generating leads. We’re in another business that is very in a similar space to yours and I think I get 10 times more leads out of Facebook, as opposed to Google, right? And I thought, if that’s happening right next door to you, what does it mean for the people who are in your market space in your area. Would I not be able to do much the same? And I said, I’m not guaranteeing you anything, “but I think we got to test and measure this.” And then they’re like, “Ah, okay all right. “Let’s give it a go.” We had to have that conversation, right? And I thought this is quite interesting, because as the world transforms and changes so rapidly and we go through exponential growth. Things change, laws change, the way we do things change. Are we actually open to testing new ideas and are we actually opening up our minds to try new things? Are we willing yo say yest to give it a go, or are we just gonna keep saying no to stuff?

– [Craig] I think this is such a good point. And I’m going to say two things. One is, I’m gonna first of all talk about where I’ve had success and I am good at this and potentially almost humble brag about results. But then the second point I’m actually gonna talk about this is actually a lesson for me, because I have this close mindedness to things that, you know, well, I’m not open to. Here I am criticizing, or getting frustrated with clients, because they won’t test stuff that I am suggesting. But, I find myself doing it. So I first of all, I’ll tell you some great success as you know Facebook’s been so good for us even today.

– [Ian] I know, I love those lead ads .

– [Craig] Lead ads and things. Well, one of my wife’s sites, you know the results, I get more than two thousand leads a month.

– Correct.

– For her, right? This is all on Facebook.

– Yes.

– Facebook right? It’s just such a killer channel. And I keep saying this. So we definitely get results and that’s why I’m so open to it, right? And then we say to clients, and they are exactly like you like, “No, no, our clients aren’t on Facebook, “they’re on LinkedIn right?” And we go, “Well, have you tested that, “have you actually tested that, “or is it just biases?” So this is the problem we all have our own biases. So that’s the first point. My second point, do you know what my biases are? I am actually bias against anything that I’m not suggesting to clients. So one of the things I’m actually trying to embrace now and be more open to is LinkedIn. Because I haven’t had much success in the past, and I have tested and measured, and yet it keeps coming up. People say, “LinkedIn, LinkedIn, LinkedIn.” I’m like, Yeah, it just doesn’t work for me.” I’m actually reading books now on it, and doing courses, because I really wanna try it. Some people are getting it to work, and I’m just gonna continue testing and trying to get it to work. But let’s talk about some of the other examples, like Google versus Bing. Do you find this?

– Yeah, .

– They go, “Ah we’re going to be on Google ads?” “But have you tried Bing ads?” “Oh no. “No one there.” I’m like, “Well have you actually tested that? “is it based on just your opinion and cognitive bias, “or do you actually got data to back that up?”

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] It’s often it’s just emotional. Or, and we find sometimes as marketing managers, “No the boss said that’s not where they are.” And I’m like, “The boss, has he done testing? “That’s your job you should be doing the testing “should be telling your boss

– Okay.

– “what’s working “and providing data. “Rather than kind of, ill informed judgment coming down” However, when a client says, “No we’re not gonna do that “we tested it and it didn’t work.” I see the data and it didn’t work. I’m like, “Great, that’s great they tried it.” So I think this all comes back to this whole approach, be open to it. If you’re gonna reject it, make sure you’re rejecting it based on data.

– [Ian] Correct and Id’s say make sure, like I know for you, for both of us, we tried lead ads in Facebook a while back then it kind of stopped working. We stopped doing it and we’re both going back to it now, because it’s generating lots of, it’s working right? And again, did you know Google’s now trying it? I just did–

– You showed me this. And I was going, “Oh my goodness, I wanna try this.” Yeah, absolutely.

– Google ads, they’re just rolling out the equivalent of a lead ad on Facebook, they’re rolling it out to Google, so people never leave Google. It’s that whole experience of, “Oh, I’ve seen that. “I can inquire right now “and I could continue “browsing away.”

– I think they’re going to convert really well. And especially on mobile of course.

– [Ian] Correct.

– [Craig] However, what you’ll also see on Google, this is what I’m really interested to see. Is people will do the lead ads, but they’ll be on a search result and they’ll just go, “Oh lead ad, lead ad, lead ad.” So they’ll probably submitting four of the lead ads. So I think that you’ll get the leads a lot quicker, but of course you’ll be competing with more people, rather than if they came to your site or filled out a form, et cetera. So very interested to see what your test results.

– Now you know what’s really interesting, I’ve also been testing out the messaging feature within Google Ads. The ability for someone to click it, opens up a message, and then sends the message to you.

– [Craig] Just like via Google My Business, is that the right one?

– No, so this is directly from the ad, doesn’t go via Google My Business.

– [Craig] So how does the message come in?

– [Ian] I think it generates the SMS, and then when you click send, it sends it to the number, or it sends it to–

– Right, yep.

– [Ian] That’s how it happens. I haven’t had a lot of success with that, but again I’m testing and measuring in different markets to see whether people are taking that up. It could vary from market to market.

– [Craig] See the difference I think between these lead ads, verses Facebook is gonna be the intent. So if you’ve got a lead ad and you get someone to fill it out on Google I reckon they’re high intent, and I think your time to respond is gonna be so important.

– Yes.

– [Craig] If there’s a list on Facebook, you do a lead ad normally it’s for an asset, you don’t have to respond quickly they just get it by automation. I think there’s gonna be a different mentality or a different approach required.

– [Ian] You know what, that’s absolutely right, Craig.

– [Craig] Yeah, it’ll be interesting to see how things pan out.

– [Ian] Yeah well we’ll let you know guys, as we test and measure. We’ll let you know how we’re going.

– [Craig] All right well, look let’s just finish a few examples. Here’s conversations that I get from my clients,

– Yes.

– [Craig] See if you get these that say, we want to be on LinkedIn, our audience is not on Facebook. So that’s fun.

– Yep.

– Another is, we wanna be on Google Ads, not on Bing,. We’re not even, don’t just dismiss Bing outright. Another one is, they’ll go, “Oh we wanna be on Instagram.” But they’ll dismiss Twitter. So in all those cases, probably the former, you’ll have no problems convincing people to. But the latter ones, you won’t. So I would definitely say, consider Facebook, consider Bing Ads, and consider Twitter as well. We’re pushing back into Twitter. I know I’ve said this many times on the show. But, yeah.

– [Ian] And here’s the bonus I think, What about YouTube? People think that to be on YouTube, you need to actually run video ads, but actually you don’t need to run video ads to be on YouTube. So there’s another option, actually another channel to test, to get in front of your potential audience. All right, Craig, App of the Week.

– [Craig] So it’s not really App of the Week, is it? It’s Function of the Week.

– [Ian] It’s Function of the Week.

– [Craig] Plus, it’s only on iPhone. right there.

– [Ian] That’s right. Well you know, I was talking to a bunch of people. Actually, it was to my connect group at that, my business connect group at church. And, I was talking about, what were we talking about? I think we were talking about growth, or something around that nature. But it came down to, how distracted are we, as individuals get bombarded by more and more things and have more and more things to do. How do we stay focused on what we’re doing? And one of the things I actually heard from them, was turning off your notifications on your phone, so when the first thing you get up in the morning, you don’t look at your phone and start going through your emails. And one thing I’ve been using for awhile now, on an iPhone, in the clock app, there is a bedtime feature, so you basically say, “Look I want eight hours of sleep “and I wanna get up at this time.” So it calculates back and says, “Okay you need to go to bed at this.” So for me, because I get up quite early to go,

– I can’t believe how early you get up. You get up at a quarter to five every morning.

– [Ian] Yeah. So I try to be in bed by nine o’clock, and so I can get enough sleep, because I know that if I don’t, I’m gonna be wrecked the next morning and also, it makes it really hard. So I’ve kind of made that a routine, but actually what happens is, when it A, notifies you that your bedtime’s coming up. So it kind of gives you a warning this is gonna happen and then it basically shuts down all notifications. It snoozes everything. And all you see is that, all notifications are snoozed, and you don’t get anything til the morning, until you’re awake. And I love it, because you know what, it’s just peace of mind and it’s quiet, so.

– [Craig] Look I think distraction free is a general principle. And for marketers, especially, when we need to be creative and strategic and things like that. This morning, I had such a good run. You know, I have some days that just it all fits together.

– Yes.

– Like, you just, oh I don’t know, everything comes together. You get a good night sleep. You’re really motivated. This morning, like I came in, put my phone aside. I didn’t even check email. I just went in I was doing HumDB and Hubble. Maybe that’s not . Just putting together customers, just building and coding and putting together a site. It was so good. And I was like, “Oh my goodness. “It’s lunchtime.” I couldn’t believe it. “Oh I better check emails. “Find out who’s “complaining about me .” Hadn’t even been on Slack, my team were like, “Oh there he is .” Tell you what, the thing distraction free, you get so much done.

– You do.

– It’s amazing.

– [Ian] So there, that’s another highlight. People were unaware that that was a feature on your phone. On to our Reasons of the Week. And this is blogging tips for beginners from Atris.

– [Craig] Yeah, look I’m not even gonna call out any of these. This is just a reminder. I send these to my team as well, saying, “Oh here’s blogging tips. “Or here’s something on keyword research.” Just always reminding people to go and check these things out.

– [Ian] All right, Craig. Quote of the week.

– [Craig] A good one you found. We’ll call this a legacy quote.

– [Ian] It is. It’s from Mark Twain. “20 years from now, you’ll be more disappointed “by the things that you didn’t do, “then by the ones you did do. “So sail away from the safe harbour. “Explore, dream and discover.

– [Craig] There you go, sail away from the safe harbour of LinkedIn and try Facebook.

– [Ian] There are some bonus links in the show. So check that out, when you’re not driving, running around on the beach. And, we’d love you to share this podcast with somebody. And, if you can, take 20 seconds to leave us a rating on Spotify or Apple Podcasts. It would greatly help us. Well listeners, until next time. Craig, have a good week.

– [Craig] Catch you later, Ian.

– [Presenter] Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes and the latest HubSpot news and tips, please visit us at hobshots.com.

Episode 180

Episode 180: HubSpot HUGcast

Welcome to HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode is a special episode: The HUGcast, involving the Sydney HubSpot User Group.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/180-hubspot-hugcast/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

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Recorded: Wednesday 23 October, 2019 | Published: Friday November 29, 2019.

Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

HubSpot HUGcast

– Hello there, my name is Craig Bailey. I am one of the organizers of the Sydney HubSpot User Group, and I’d like to invite you to our next event, which is this coming Wednesday 27th of November. It’s our final for the year, and it’s going to be an informative night. If you haven’t been before let me tell you about the format. There’s between 50 and 80 smart, interested, digital marketers in the room, and the agenda for the night has three particular items. We have a tip of the night, which I’m gonna go through with you in the next few minutes. There’s a keynote presentation, which dives into industry research and trends. And then, a panel at the end, where we get smart people who have experience with the particular topic of the night, who give their tips and tricks as well as answering questions from the audience. Now, the theme of the night is sales and marketing alignment. As part of that, and the reason for the tip of the night, we’re gonna look at how sales teams and marketing teams can work together, better. With that in mind, the tip of the night that I’m gonna go through is around deal workflows. And, you might say, well if I’m gonna go through the tip now, why would I bother turning up on the night? Well, two reasons. One, this is just the start. So, come for the rest of the night, the presentation and the panel. But two, if you’ve got any questions about this, or perhaps feedback and tips of your own, I’d love to hear them. Leave them in the comments or bring them along, and let’s chat further on the night. But, one of the great reasons to look at deal workflows is because, as marketers, we’re very good at workflows, typically. We have had years of experience working with workflows in HubSpot. But as salespeople, we perhaps don’t use workflows as much. Sales people use deals really well, whereas marketers don’t perhaps know deals as well. So, this is a great way for sales and marketing to work together by using deal based workflows to really help the sales processes, and drive more efficiency. So, what we’re gonna do, because deals have a lot of power and functionality, is we’re going to look at it as a way to notify internal stakeholders. So, when the deal is won, we’re gonna trigger on that. It’s gonna send an email internally. It’s gonna create a task. It’s gonna update a slack channel, and it’s going to send an SMS message. So, let’s log into HubSpot and look at how that all works. This is our agency portal. We have 191 workflows. What you might find interesting though, is if I look at our deal workflows, we’ve only got three. All the others are contact and company ones. And, of the three, we’re only using one that’s active. Perhaps you’re similar to us. And, in some ways this tip of the night, I’m preaching to myself because there’s a lot of power here that we could be using more effectively. Perhaps you have a similar ratio, and this is some ideas for you as well. Let’s dive into our actual workflow, and look at how it works. As you probably know, if you’ve used workflows before, you have triggers that kick off the workflow, and then you have actions that take place as part of the workflow. In our case, we’re just triggering it on a deal being won, being marked as won, and that kicks off a number of actions. You can see, I’ve just clicked the plus button here. Here’s all the available actions. We’re not gonna go through them now. You can go through those. But, what I will look at is just a few specific ones that we use in ours. This is creating a task. You can see how you can use deal tokens in the task. There’s create task in HubSpot. You can create internal email notifications. So, you can choose all the recipients that that’s gonna go to. Here’s the subject line. Again, deal tokens. And, there’s the body of the email. You can include details of the deal. You can create slack notifications. So, this goes to our whole XEN team, letting everyone in the company know that a deal’s been won. And, including details about the deal. And then, you could do some branching. I just put this in to show you that perhaps, you have different processes based on, for example, the amount of the deal. A big deal versus a little deal. You might have different processes. Then you can use the go action at the end, to pull them all together, and then finally, you might have an internal SMS notification. So, that just sends to my mobile. Again, in the text message, you can include deal tokens. That’s pretty much it. An overview of the deal workflow. Hopefully, that makes sense and you’re getting some ideas about how you can incorporate these into your own company. Let me highlight two things though. If you wanna get SMS messages, it’s important that, in your own profile, you include a mobile number. If you don’t have the mobile, you actually won’t be an option to receive SMS messages. So, if you’re going for that action, and you can’t find anyone to send an SMS to, make sure that the mobile numbers are in the profile. And then finally, how do we connect slack? You’ll see here, HubSpot has this new app Marketplace icon. You go in the app Marketplace. Looks like this. You’ll search for slack, and find it. There we go. You’ll click to connect it. I’ve already done that in our portal. So, if I go over to our settings, if I was to go up on the cog, and then settings, and come down here to connected apps. I’ll look for slack. It would have been connected, and you can see some of the options that I’ve set. Default channels that things go out to. So, you need all that for the slack notifications, and setting things there. Apart from that, it’s pretty easy. Pretty straightforward. I hope that’s helpful. I really look forward to seeing you next Wednesday, at the HubSpot User Group. Leave me a comment or leave me feedback. Any questions you’ve got. Tips or tricks, and let’s chat further at the HUG.

Episode 179

Episode 179: Quick HubSpot Conversations tip, Duplicate content considerations

Welcome to Episode 197 of Hubshots!

HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about how HubSpot Conversations saves you time, plus testing emails in HubSpot.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/episode-179-quick-hubspot-conversations-tip-duplicate-content-considerations/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

Join the Facebook group here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hubshots/

Follow us on Twitter here: https://twitter.com/hubshots

Follow us on Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/hubshotspodcast/

Follow us on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/company/hubshots/

Recorded: Wednesday 23 October 2019 | Published: Friday 8 November 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Building a moat

For HubSpot, their key side-differentiators (ie separate to the product) are:

  • High-quality support
  • HubSpot Academy

Sure, lots of companies have good support (eg WP Engine, Amazon), so that’s not a moat on its own.

The HubSpot Academy, on the other hand, is a significant moat that very few companies come close to, and the gap is widening every day. Soon it will be impossible for any competitors to stand a chance of getting near them.

In terms of product – having quality through the product suite is very hard to reach as well.

How many products do you slot into multiple parts of your business (ie like a suite should do)?


g2 hubspot

Image from here:


Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Email testing tools within HubSpot.  You realise what you don’t have until you are using other systems!

Edit Email   Test

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Sales Training

Sales professionals with three to four years of selling experience spend 50% more time on training than those with two years or less and 110% as those with five years or more — probably because rookies aren’t sure if they’re going to stay in sales and veterans don’t believe they need to develop further.

The Power of Content in Sales

Frictionless Sale Certification

Shot 4: HubSpot Service Feature of the Week

Using Conversations to reduce your workload

We get a lot of outreach emails to our sites, which are often just wasting our time.

They all tend to use sequence-based tools so we get multiple follow-ups.

One of the useful features of Conversations is you can just Block the sender, or Mark as spam and then any follow up are automatically ‘filtered’ so you never see them.

Inbox 1

Here’s 522 conversations that we’ve been able to avoid:

Inbox 2

Save time!

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Keeping email deliverability good and the effort these guys have gone to make sure you get their emails!


We re Upgrading  Add Us to Your Safe Senders List   ian jacob searchandbefound com au   Search   Be Found Mail

Action: What are you doing regularly to ensure people are getting your emails?

Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Thinking through Duplicate Content in Google’s eyes

Key point: there’s no duplicate content penalty, instead there is content filtering.





Focus on making your content as useful as possible for a visitor.

If the content is repeated on your site but in a way that is useful to visitors, then chances are Google will understand that.

If you have content that is also used on other sites (eg especially common on eCommerce sites) then Google will surface the version that is most useful to the person searching.

A simple example: Consider a car dealership eg Hyundai

Most of the content around car models will be exactly the same on all of the sites, similarly with service and finance options.

But none of these sites are penalised.

Instead Google will show the most relevant site to a person searching eg location will be a big factor, as well as previous viewing history, the device they are on etc.

Shot 7: Podcast of the Week

Akimbo by Seth and the episode about Friction!


Friction   Akimbo  A Podcast from Seth Godin   Overcast

Shot 8: Resource of the Week

PPC Trends for 2020

(yes the 2020 posts have started already!)


Key points:

  • Automation of your advertising
  • AI (of course!)
  • Video ads (eg Google’s Bumper Machine)
  • Responsive search ads become the norm

Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“Let’s not confuse getting better at stuff with being a better person. One is a much bigger priority than the other.”

October 22 in The Daily Stoic

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

Competitor analysis process


Audience segmentation


Redirects before and after a site update:


The Disrupter CMO:


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.
Episode 179

– Hi, everyone, welcome to Hubshots episode 197. In this episode, we share our Hubspot conversation, saving you time, plus testing emails in Hubspot and duplicate content considerations. Now there’s a tongue twister, Craig? You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one Hubspot focused podcast where we discuss household tips, tricks, strategies and features for growing yourselves, marketing, and service results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. Now, Craig, why are you laughing so hard?

– Oh, I’m just like, “Are we gonna leave that “in at the start?” Are we not gonna restart or re-record that one, let’s just get going.

– Yeah, absolutely.

– So our growth thought of the week, Craig, building a mote. And why are we talking about this? Because there was an interesting Twitter post which–

– From an online person called Brian Helligan. It talked about between 19 marketing tech stack across three different areas, attract, engage, analyze and optimize and Hubspot was in all three of those.

– Well, for one particular company, J.J. Crab. So this is actually pretty cool. It’s got Brinker from Martech has this little, it’s not really a competition, but it’s kind of a survey where people submit their marketing stack. As you know there’s thousands of tools and one of them G2 Crowd, this was their stack and Hubspot was in all three, I guess, stages of their stack and of course we can go and check out some of the other ones, and so I’ve got links in the show notes. But we’re talking about this idea of building a mote and what I thought was interesting was, well, there’s a product mote, there’s your product is so good that people can’t get close. You’re protecting yourself with a mote, but I think there’s other different chattings that Hubspot have just besides their product and I think we’re gonna chat about some of those. And one you always heard about us talking on this show is the high quality of support. Yeah, and you know how lots of companies have great support these days?

– Yes.

– It’s not that much of a differentiator, but I’ve gotta say, with Hubspot’s support, not only is it very timely and very quick to respond, but there’s actually quite well-trained people. There are senior people on support and I was listening to you on a support call today, I’ve never had this experience where they go, “Oh, I’ll just check that “and get back to you, and in the background “all they’re doing is a Google search, “and trying to find something.”

– Great.

– They’re actually really well-trained–

– Yes.

– They’re very knowledgeable and they often come back with answers that I hadn’t even considered which I know sounds a little bit arrogant, but I guess it’s just because my benchmark, getting support from people, the first support response I get is something that I’ve already found after a one second Google search.

– Okay.

– It’s just so condescending. Hubspot is never like that. Their support is great. So lots of companies have great support, Hubspot’s is excellent. However that’s not that much of a differentiator these days. However I think what is is one particular asset they’ve been building.

– Which is the Hubspot academy.

– And I often tell this to people that say, “Why should I consider Hubspot “or whey should I use this tool?” And I say, “Look, everything that’s in there, “in the academy that we used “to train our teams and I know you do too.” And we train ourselves using that training. And so I always tell people, you can know as much as we do by using that training and actually applying yourself to the system. Obviously, we use it day in, day in out. Not everybody uses it the same as we do, but it’s all there, it’s just a matter of finding it, learning it and applying it. Yeah, so not only is the content good, but it’s very well-organized, a nice sub sort of category because, so for example, Google, they have a lot of online around tools, Google Analytics, Google Ads. It’s impossible to find. How do you find it? It’s not well-structured and, we’re just gonna, Hubspot Academy is a must. This is a keeper. Can you think of any other company that can even get close?

– Wow.

– Send us a comment. Tell us if there’s any product trend or software, anything that comes close to what Hubspot has with Hubspot Academy. I’d love to see it.

– Now in terms of support, Craig, I wanna say, look, we think use WP Engine and we use their support, but that support is on live chat and there’s no “pick up the phone, let’s call you up.”

– This is true.

– So in that perspective, when you think about support, Hubspot has three different channels and they offer you support on being it a call, they can call you back. You can do a live chat and you can log a ticket. So I think they give you many options and I actually really like how we pretty much get 24/7 support because it goes from Singapore to Dublin, I think then to Boston and back around again. So for we us, we have dealt with people in Boston and Dublin previously. We do it with a lot of people in Singapore because of the time difference now and again, if I am up late at night and doing stuff at rather odd hours, you do get people from Dublin and Boston which is great. And I think there’s a consistency across the team, so well done to Hubspot support.

– All right, Craig, our Hubspot marketing feature of the week.

– I’ve spoken about this on previous shows. It’s about email testing and do you know that there is actually email testing within the Hubspot marketing email too? Where you can choose, I don’t know how many different options there were, there were literally about 50 different options about you wanted to test your email on an iPhone XS running iOS 13 running outlook 2013 on Windows, Outlook in the Chrome browser, so many things. Anyway, you’ve heard us talk about Litmus before where they basically do email testing across browsers and across systems. Well, this is built into Hubspot. You can go ahead and select what you want and you can run the test, see the results, and get it out the other end.

– Now I’m assuming there’s a significant cost to run those tests, is there?

– No, there isn’t.

– Testing nearly of course is just clicking a few buttons.

– I know, actually doing it, this is what’s incredible about it. And why would I mention that because you might be thinking, “Oh, well it’s costly for you.” Well, we’ve used other tools in the past where they have the option for email testing and then they’ll charge you a certain amount to test with other platforms, so this is just something you get from Hubspot for free. Let me just take you, like one of the ones that we’ve used previously in the past you could use called Litmus. They charge $99 a month if you wanna do email testing. You know what I wanna say, Litmus is, well, it’s the gold standard. So they’re probably better. I would assume they’re better actually. They better be better for that price and they’re testing that they do. Have you used it recently?

– No, I haven’t.

– Yeah, I haven’t used it for a long time, actually. I just use Hubspot mainly for our clients.

– All right, now onto Hubspot’s sales feature of the week, Craig.

– I wanted to highlight this. “Sales professionals often should “be selling, but also require training.” And one, what’s really interesting is they have a really good stat is that sales professionals with three to four years of sales experience spend 50% or more of their time in those with two years or less. And 110% of those with five years or more probably because rookies aren’t sure if they’re going to stay in sales and veterans don’t believe they need to develop further. So this is about them doing their sales training and actually having time. So what’s another interesting step that people use is that in businesses, sales managers say they spend about 50% of their time actually training their sales team, but really it’s 25 to 30% of the time that they actually do it. And I think I spoke about this before. There’s an interesting step that I’ve heard from somebody that worked in Apple is that they spend the first hour of every day doing sales training. So these are people in the Apple Store. This is the first thing they do every morning. They do an hour sales training.

– Really?

– Yeah.

– Like before the store opens?

– Correct.

– Wow, this is staff on the floor.

– This is somebody that used to work in a store was telling me about it.

– So let me just check, so every day I spend an hour every day before the store opens.

– Wow, anyway, so coming back to that, I really, because I’ve been training a few sales teams, I’ve been pointing them to resource and then I’m gonna be like, “What training can we do?” So there were actually two bits of training that I’m wanting to highlight and I’ve started doing one of them, I haven’t done the other. The first one is frictionless sales certifications. That’s something that’s been brought up by Hubspot so I would encourage you to do that. I think it’s about two hours worth of videos and then there’s a test at the end, and then there’s another one which is the power of content in sales, having the right collateral for your sales process and the influence of content.

– Look, I’m totally distracted by that Apple’s done an hour of training–

– Yes.

– Every morning before, I’ve been thinking about it, you know what I’m gonna do?

– You’re gonna walk into the Apple Store and ask them?

– No, no, I’m going to show my team and myself every day before you get the email or anything, you’ve gotta do an hour of training on Hubspot Academy, let’s say. Let’s try that for a month.

– Yeah, that’s a good challenge.

– Let’s see how that goes.

– Yeah.

– You’d make time to do things.

– Exactly.

– But everyone on the team kinda has a bit of quieter or a guide that they’re supposed to do in terms of training each week. No one does it, but myself, I’d pull leading by example in this because whose life gets in the way and it’s something, there’s always something urgent. They just say, “Oh, I know, well, I put training off “or I block it in the afternoon now. “There’s a client call at the,” But once if we said the fist hour, you’re not allowed to touch email until you’ve done an hour of training on the Hubspot Academy. You would make time for it.

– Yeah.

– You would have to make it happen.

– Exactly.

– I think I’m gonna do it. This challenge is on. Who’s with me?

– I’m with you, Craig? All right, there we go. Do the frictionless sales certification, Craig. Let’s get going. All right, onto the Hubspot sales feature of the week, Craig. Using conversations to reduce your workload.

– Yeah, you know how I love Hubspot conversations. We don’t talk enough about this on the show, I don’t think. We haven’t really given as much prominence as it deserves, I feel. So we use Hubspot conversations, in fact, in a number of our businesses, but one of them that’s an online training base, one of my wife’s sites, it gets quite a lot of support requests coming in. We used to use another product. We’ve now moved that over to conversations in Hubspot. We don’t even use tickets. It’s all conversations because they come in by email or LinkedIn, Hubspot–

– Messenger.

– Facebook, Facebook Messenger that comes in and the form now comes in ’cause it’s–

– The support form, right?

– The support form links right into the conversation.

– Yeah.

– Now it’s great. It’s not as full-featured as the tool we had before. However it’s saving us a lot more time because of one key little feature and we’ve–

– Tell me, Craig, what is the key little feature?

– If you’re in conversations and you’re looking in conversation you can assign it to yourself, but then up in the top-right there’s this little dropdown and there’s move the trash, block sender, or mark it spam. You’ve got three options there.

– Yep.

– And we get so many outreach emails and junk support requests coming in.

– I know, I was reading some of those outreach emails like, “Hi, I’ve reached to you out “the first time and you haven’t responded.” Oh, the second one. “I’ve reached you for the second time “and you haven’t responded.” Third time, fourth time, I was like, “Really?” These people because they’re all only sequences, right? They’re probably using Hubspot Sequences to send their spam outreach emails. Well, there’s any number of tools, Malshake and others. But anyways, the first time that comes in we’re just gonna write mark as spam or block sender, and then all their follow-ups, all those nine followups just go into the filtered section in conversations, so we never see them again. It is saving us so much time and I’ve got a screenshot here since we just added this in which was a couple of months ago. We’ve switched over to Hubspot Conversations. 522 conversations have been filtered out as spam. It’s saving us–

– So much time.

– Such a mess here.

– Oh, yeah, it’s saving us so much time.

– So tell me, on the previous system that you used, this did not happen.

– No, in fact, what would happened is they’d come in, we’d go just go, “I’ll mark it as resolved.”

– Yep.

– To get it out. Then I would do the followup. That would come in as a new ticket.

– Oh.

– Yeah, it was really frustrating. Now I think it was an older system. It was Desk by Salesforce is what we used to use. So maybe it’s an older system and maybe there’s newer systems that would’ve been better then. Desk might have been better. I don’t know, but it just used to waste so much of our time because if you think that we’re not reaching in the four fives, that’s five interruptions to–

– Then it just removes.

– Respond. Yeah, now admittedly in Monotech a couple seconds I was now on there, he was like, “Okay, I’ll blank it out.” But that’s contact switching. It’s just chewing up and it’s cycles. So that’s what saves us this time and as we get more and more like that, actual business is getting more and more popular, I’m getting lots more of those spam outreach, it’s just gonna save us more and more time. So compounds, compounding returns. Thank you, Hubspot, excellent.

– Now, Craig, onto our marketing tip of the week. And this is about keeping email deliverability good and the effort some people will go through to make sure that you get their emails. I’ll put a screenshot here and I think there’s an email I signed up to here a little while ago. But what I found really interesting was that they said they’re in the process, they actually sent me an email saying they’re in the process of updating their customer service experience and they wanna make sure that I’ve received the latest news and event updates, right? And the domain it comes from had changed. So what they’d done, they had put in the email is to ensure that you get these emails. Please make sure that we’re in your address book and it needs to be updated with the new email sending domain, right? So then they said what the domain was and then they basically, they created a whole page, they’ve created a learning page about how to white list or get your IT team to put the domain in so that you actually got this email and it’s pretty comprehensive. So if you click that link, you’ll actually see that. What are your thoughts on this? What percentage of people would get this and actually go and do that?

– Well, if you’re really keen, for example, Morning Brew, if I got that and I really wanted to continue on, I would probably go through there for it. I really like Morning Brew. I’ve never missed a Morning Brew. I’ve never done that.

– Well, that’s exactly–

– I’d rather add it to white list. But this is the thing, and I guess it’s not so much for us in the sense that we’re using Google for work for our stuff. There are people where businesses that we deal with, say, like in the medical sector that would have that very strict email filtering in their businesses. And even things from Hubspot will get blocked before it even gets to the person.

– Really?

– Yes.

– Okay.

– By an IT filtering rule.

– Right, so how are they even gonna get notified to do this?

– Well, this is the thing, right? So I guess the thing here is that if they were already receiving it, they wanna make sure that if anything further happens–

– It doesn’t get restricted or changed, yeah?

– It’s a change, right?

– Yeah, you can say that.

– It sounds like I’ve just signed up for something, can you please make sure? There have been people that have done that. And there is somebody that I am seeing do this. When you sign up say, “Oh, look, make sure that “if you’re using this, make sure you drag “it into your primary folder “so you make sure you get our emails.” Which I thought was actually really good and then on the landing thank you page actually alerting people that this could happen, but if you wanna hear from us, make sure that it is in your primary inbox. So that’s a really good one and this is just another extreme of that. Look, it’s a good idea and I get that there’s so much email and it gets put into folders, so I wonder, I’d love to know, how would you even measure the effectiveness of this, whether they do it?

– Well, you check the deliverability and you open, right, it was the same as before.

– Well, that’s true. You can compare open rights. Deliverability wouldn’t change.

– Yeah.

– ‘Cause just ’cause it’s another folder it’s still delivered.

– Yep.

– If that’s in your news folder–

– That’s true, there’s still a limit.

– So what I clicked is create.

– That would be the indicator.

– To create would be key, yeah, if they did have IT rules that blocked it then that would effect deliverability. It would be your blocked emails.

– Correct, and you can see that in Hubspot.

– You’ll see that it is a bounced email and it has been blocked by the receiver’s domain and that domain cannot receive email.

– Very good food for though there.

– There you go. What’s our insight of the week, Craig?

– All right, I’m revisiting duplicate content. How many times a week have I did this one the show? So many times, but it keeps coming up and– A lot of people talk about it, right?

– A lot of people are really worried about this, how I’m gonna get a duplicate content penalty.

– Yes.

– So I’ll just give a bit of context, it’s come up this week with a whole bunch of–

– Customers, clients.

– Well, prospects.

– Oh, yes.

– Kyle was at a conference to a whole bunch of our prospects and this came up. Hey, shout out to Kyle, here, by the way, anyway, there’s this idea that if you have content that is on your sight that is on someone else’s sight, you are gonna get a content penalty. Google will penalize your side because you’ve got duplicate content. Now this has, well, a long history because 10 years ago that was much more potentially a problem. It was actually a sense of content, duplicate content penalty, but that hasn’t been the case for years. And to prove the point, in the show notes, I’ve got four separate high authority sites talking about this. One of them is Google talking about this. Anyway, there is no such thing as a duplicate content penalty anymore. In fact, all it’ll call it is content filtering. And here just to set the scope, this is what I’m talking about, people just creating websites, using content, okay? So we’re not talking about those blackout SEOs that do things to manipulate rankings. That might be treated differently, but for all the other businesses that put up content, so typical example, eCommerce side, maybe you’re selling a product on your eCommerce side that isn’t on other products. Maybe it’s on Amazon. You will use similar product descriptions, all this kinda thing. You are not gonna get penalized. However, what Google will do is they will filter and they will filter for the user who’s doing the search to give that user what they consider the best result. Now to give you a very simple example, if it’s location-based, you’re in Sydney, someone else in Melbourne or someone else is in New York.

– Yes.

– Now if you’re searching in New York, whose site do you recon Google’s gonna show the content from. It’s not gonna be the Sydney based one.

– Exactly.

– It’s gonna be the New York one by us, in Sydney, vice versa, right? So that’s what filtering is in action. So this is kinda what the, yeah, as I said, a bunch of people say just trying to read or write this case got some turnout there and I’ll give you a great example in Australia or in other countries. Car dealerships–

– Yes.

– So think of Hyundai. The Hyundai car they are shipping, all these dealers around–

– Australia.

– Australia, in fact, in Sydney there have been multiple Hyundai dealers. Go to their sites, probably 90% of the content on their sites is gonna be the same as every other dealer because they’re gonna have all the car models, bringing up all the finance options.

– The same specific interest.

– The site specs are gonna have probably the same or very similar service offerings, right? And then I’ll have a bit of some original content around their team and a few other things. And a few other things, maybe somebody related, right? Most of the content is the same as every other Hyundai dealer, okay?

– Do you think Google has a penalty on Hyundai dealerships?

– Yeah.

– Hyundai. But what they will do is, they’ll filter it, right? And so if you’re in a particular suburb searching for a Hyundai dealer, you’ll get probably the closest to you or if you’ve actually visited a previous Hyundai dealership, maybe Google will be smart enough to know that was in your history. I’ll show you that one. It probably depends on the device you’re on, like they’ll look at the sites and they’ll go, “Well, this site actually works “on mobile, this one doesn’t.” So if you’re mobile, all these factors, right?

– Yeah.

– Duplicate content penalty? No. Filtering based on what’s the best result for you? Yes.

– Correct.

– And I hope this puts the whole conversation to rest, right?

– To rest.

– If you’ve got a question about that please drop us a note and we can go into it in more details. Some of the show notes go into it in a lot of detail, so you can read through that. I hope that’s helpful.

– Okay, Craig, onto our podcast of the week. And this is a podcast from Seth Godin called “Akimbo.” And I wanna highlight one episode which talks about friction and we talk about frictionless selling. I thought this would be a good episode for people to listen to. And you know why we highlight these episodes and these podcasts to you is to actually grow your understanding beyond marketing and sales, and a lot of these, think, this is actually to broaden our horizons like we learn. And we actually learn a lot from listening to other people doing different things and growing themselves. I encourage you to, if you can’t listen to everything, at least listen to one thing.

– All right, Craig, you’ve got some good resources for the week which is BBC trends for 2020. You can post here from Smart Insights and by the way, yes, folks, the 2020 trends posts have started already.

– They sure have.

– Brace yourself. December’s normally when they start appearing, but no,

– I’m getting into–

– That’s the sort of stuff they’re after.

– It’s like Christmas is coming.

– Yeah, Christmas is coming, that’s further on, so apologies for that, but look, this is actually a good post, ignore the headline. This is really just around some thoughts around where PPC and advertising is going on.

– So what are some key points, Craig?

– Yeah, well I’ve got a few of the highlights I just pulled out. Look, automation of your advertising, that’s what’s probably the biggest thing that’s changing, right? We see this in Google, we see this in Facebook, all the ad platforms, so much of the targeting these days, we just let Facebook work it out. Some of the ads to use, we just let Google work it out. That’s actually one of the other points, they highlight this whole idea of responsive ads. Google’s really, even Facebook’s behind on this. Facebook doesn’t do that particularly well.

– You’re right.

– Well, they do. They will show you the different sizes, but I thinK I was gonna say–

– Yeah, yes.

– Google’s not that responsive with ads.

– Well, that’s because of the placement, right? Just think about Google has so many different placements across the web that it has access to compared to Facebook. And that’s the reason. I think they’ve just had to adapt quicker because of these very massive variations that they have. What’s the next thing, artificial intelligence?

– Well, of course.

– Yes.

– We kind wore the advertising conversation out talking about AI and machine learning.

– Okay.

– So that’s of course making results better.

– And what’s the other one, video ads?

– Yeah, I thought this was a nice follow on from our insight last episode where we were talking about Facebook inflating those video attention or dwell times. But video advertising is on the rise, but in particular video ad format. So, and I mentioned bumper ads, that Google’s got that tool where it’ll just take a longer, a couple minute video and I’ll make six second trunks out of it to use those simple videos. That’s gonna become much more of the norm and I think that is the experience. People seem to be okay being interrupted for few seconds.

– Correct.

– And I think six seconds is probably about right. Those 15 second bumpers that YouTube have. Well, we’ve chatted about this on our show before. I have YouTube Pro, or I pay for it so I never see ads on YouTube, thank goodness.

– Oh, I can’t believe people sit through ads on YouTube, anyway–

– But you know what? Every time after that episode that I have on YouTube, and I see it and I just get reminded of you, Craig.

– You’re right, I would actually go further. I would actually pay for ads to be removed from Twitter.

– Okay.

– I’m not on Facebook really much these days except when I’m running, managing ad campaigns. But, Instagram, I’m hardly ever on, but I am on Twitter a fair bit.

– So would you pay to get ads removed off of Google, if you could?

– Yes, I would.

– Interesting.

– Yeah, you mean on Google Search?

– Maybe not Google Search because they’re normally high intent. So if I’m searching for something and the ad probably is very relevant to me.

– It usually is.

– YouTube, I’ve got it blocked, Twitter, I would actually pay to have them removed.

– Oh, okay.

– I’d pay five bucks. I’d pay five bucks a month for Medium, I’d pay five bucks a month for Twitter to be ad free because most of the ads are not helpful to me. And Facebook, if I was on there I would pay to optionally be able to remove it. Yeah, just ’cause it interrupts even the flow and then you just fade from me. As you know, I’ve subscribed to a whole bunch of news sites and I don’t pay for it. That’s money well spent for me.

– Okay. It’s time, right?

– It’s got less distraction.

– You’re getting less distraction, you’re getting back your time. And I kinda choke when I say that because a lot our agencies–

– Just running ads.

– Just managing ads for clients. There’s an internal conflict there which–

– It’s–

– I’m struggling with.

– Yeah, all right, Craig, onto our quote of the week.

– Oh, hell. I’ll read the quote. Well, you can read the quote. “Let’s not confuse getting better “at stuff with being a better person.” One is as much big a priority than the other and this is from the Daily Stoic which I quite like. We get better and better at ads all the time, but is it making us a better person? I don’t think so.

– No, that’s not making us better, Craig.

– Oh, my goodness, that quote was from me. all right, listen as there are some brightest links of the week that we highlight some great things to do with audience segmentation and so on. I’d love you take a look at the show. We’d love you to leave a review on Apple Podcast or Spotify and again, we’d love to hear from our listeners, if you’ve got anything at all, even just to say, “Hi,” we would love to hear from you. Wherever you are in the world, we love hearing from you guys. It’s sometimes a bit lonely here, but that’s all right. We do appreciate you listening and we do appreciate anything that we do get. And until next time, Craig.

– Catch ya later, Ian.

– Hey, there thanks for listening to this episode Hubshots. For show notes and the latest Hubshots news and tips please visit us at hubshots.com. ♪ Magic girl ♪

Episode 178

Episode 178: How to ‘Test and Measure’ when you can’t measure, plus Merging Contacts gotcha

Welcome to Episode 178 of Hubshots!

HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about how to avoid a gotcha when merging contacts, plus think through how to ‘test and measure’ video engagement.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/178-how-to-test-and-measure-when-you-cant-measure-plus-merging-contacts-gotcha/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

Join the Facebook group here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hubshots/

Follow us on Twitter here: https://twitter.com/hubshots

Follow us on Instagram here: https://www.instagram.com/hubshotspodcast/

Follow us on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/company/hubshots/

Recorded: Wednesday 23 October 2019 | Published: Friday 1 November 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Our strategy for the podcast

Using it mainly as a bottom of the funnel marketing piece.

We use it to drive perception and credibility.

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

How to change your email in HubSpot

Example scenario: you change your company domain and everyone’s email address changes

How do you update your HubSpot login to use the new address?

Go to your profile, there is a button to change your email address and follow the verification steps as outlined here > https://knowledge.hubspot.com/account/how-do-i-change-the-email-address-of-a-user
<h2″>Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

Territory rotation with Workflows


Thanks Kyle!

A good example of using workflows to help with sales processes

Shot 4: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Side-effects of merging contacts

Be aware that merging contacts can re-trigger workflows for the destination contact



You may have started getting email notifications from HubSpot telling you about contacts you can merge. This is good for data cleanliness, but can be a gotcha, which I don’t think HubSpot does a good job of warning people about.

How to handle this: Have exclusions lists in your workflows

Have a process for handling this – the best way to manage it is to have Global Suppression Lists setup which are set in all workflows. Add all the contacts you are going to merge into the Global Suppression list before your merge, and then take them out after the merge.

Listen to Shot 2 back in episode 149 for more details on how we implement this:


Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

No more mixed http and https content messages – Chrome will block http content


However, Chrome is going to do it as intelligently as possible – and will autoupgrade items (eg images) to use their https version if it is available. If not, it will simply block it.

Action item: Check your sites for http items and update to https

Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Test and Measure

How do you ‘test and measure’ if you can’t be confident in the measurements?

Take Facebooks overestimation of video views debacle:




Summary of the issue: how they calculated time spent watching (total time divided by ‘view’ instead of total time divided by ‘started watching’)

Eg if total time watched is 3 mins, and 3 people start watching, but only 1 actually views for more than 3 seconds, then there is a big difference

By one calc the average watch time is 3 mins, with the other it is 1 min, ie a 300% difference

How to accurately test and measure

The key is to push your measurement to be more than just engagement – aim to get visits and conversions as well

It’s also a reminder that using multiple analytics packages is fine – they won’t agree exactly, but they should be within 10% of each other. Eg using both HubSpot analytics and Google analytics on your site.

Here’s an example of bad marketing practices:


Shot 7: Podcast of the Week

Business Casual by Morning Brew


Shot 8: Resource of the Week


Question: Is it a problem if my page has multiple H1 tags.

Answer: No

John Mueller gives a few pointers:


12  Multiple H1 headings  how to handle them for SEO   accessibility   AskGoogleWebmasters   YouTube

Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“Dressing well is a form of good manners.”

  • Tom Ford

From Clare Sheng’s wonderful book: The Suit Book

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

Google Search Console has a few new reports related to video (if you use markup with your videos):


Ahrefs is building a search engine with a 90/10 revenue sharing model


Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

Episode 178

– [Ian] Hi everyone, welcome to HubShots episode 178. In this episode, we look at how to test and measure when you can’t measure plus merging contacts, gotcha in HubSpot. You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one HubSpot-focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks, features and strategies for growing your marketing and sales results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you, Craig?

– [Craig] Really good and you know what’s unusual about this episode? We’re actually recording this during daylight hours.

– I know.

– For once. So you came over, we had lunch together–

– [Ian] That’s right.

– [Craig] and it’s about four o’clock in the afternoon.

– [Ian] It’s a cracker of a day outside, I have to say.

– [Craig] It’s so good, but yeah, there’s light, it’s light as we record. Normally, we’re recording late at night so this is a bit of a treat for us.

– [Ian] Onto our growth strategy for the week, Craig, or our growth thought for the week.

– [Craig] Yeah, well, this is something that I’ve said a couple of episodes. We’re gonna chat about our approach to the podcast because this has came up at the HubSpot user group back in September and we’re just gonna mention our approach and this might be useful to listeners because we actually don’t use the podcast as a top of the funnel base, which people might think is weird. Aren’t you trying to get new listeners? Aren’t you trying to grow your audience? Of course everyone wants that and we do want that. And as our listenership grows, that’s great. But once you know the key criteria, actually what we use it for or I’ll talk about it myself, you can chat maybe a little bit different, but it’s a credibility piece. So, for me and our agency, it’s very much bottom of the funnel. It’s about showing our expertise. It’s also about our credibility. And so, rather than generating leads from the podcast, it’s more about when we get a prospect, we’re chatting with them, they look to the podcast to get confidence in us. So, it’s more of a closer. It’s actually more of a sales tool at the end than a marketing tool at the top. How do you feel? Is that similar for you?

– [Ian] It has been very similar for me, Craig, and even more so probably for this year, I would say that’s been a big part of it. So, I think I am trying to with some of the stuff we’re doing internally in our business and like we’ve been doing for ourselves is try to drive more of that to the top of the funnel, so to get people interested.

– [Craig] And here’s the thing. A lot of our work just comes through referral. So, the question for, well, other agencies and small businesses is if you’re getting a lot of work through referrals, should you actually be spending time at the top of the funnel awareness and all these kind of bigger company play books? And well, no, not really. Why would you spend money and time and effort focusing on completely new audiences, if you’re getting referral, right? That makes sense for small business. But as you grow, of course, referral kind of plateaus and you do need to move more to and inbound marketing piece and much more top of the funnel. So, we will be pushing that as we’re growing and I think that’s probably our 2020 goal. We’ll be doing a lot more of that. Pushing the podcast out there, a bit more awareness. But anyway, I just thought that was, perhaps, interesting for our listeners and marketers in general. It’s always about thinking what’s the goal for each piece of content and the strategy behind it. Anyway, just an insight into ours.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, onto our HubSpot Marketing feature of the week. And this is about how to change your email in HubSpot. Now, why I’m gonna highlight this is I had a customer of ours that has moved their email from a dot com domain to a dot com dot au or vice versa and they wanted to know well, how do I change this? Now, in previous times, I would’ve gone oh, you need to create a new user for yourself, go through the whole process, then reassign all the contacts to yourself. Anyway, you don’t need to do that. You go to your profile preferences. You can actually edit your email address that’s associated to your account and then you have to go through the reverification process again, but it means that now you don’t have to go through all that malarkey that you used to do before. So, there you go.

– [Craig] Who would’ve thought it was that simple, eh?

– [Ian] I know.

– [Craig] Just go to your profile and update it.

– [Ian] Thank you to HubSpot Support for pointing that out to us.

– [Craig] By the way, I was listening when you had that HubSpot ’cause you called them, right?

– That’s right.

– And, well, apart from some interesting on hold music.

– [Ian] I know that, the on hold music, I don’t know about the on hold music.

– [Craig] Worth calling ’em just to listen to that, my goodness. But anyway, it’s super helpful. I’m sure we have, but have we ever had a bad support experience? Gee, they’re good.

– [Ian] I think about this is the marketing and growth thought of the week. That’s one thing that they’ve nailed, support. All right, onto our HotSpot sales feature of the week Craig. Territory rotation with work flows. Shout out to Kyle for this blog post

– Jepson.

– Yep. They’ve been pushing a lot on round work flows and you know how we love work flows.

– I know.

– I love work flows.

– [Ian] I read this when I got the email notification. It was actually really good.

– [Craig] I think the message from this more generally is you can do anything with work flows. That’s where we’re getting to the point where when someone has a question how do I do this? It’s not a standard feature. It’s like, well, my go-to is I’m pretty sure we can work out how to do that in a work flow. So, this is a good article in this. In this case, territories and assigning them, rotation. So a good post so just go through and get an insight into that.

– [Ian] All right, onto the HubSpot gotcha of the week Craig and this has to do with the side effects of merging contacts. Now, I’m liking this feature in HubSpot, right? And been getting notifications and my customers are getting confused. They’re like what is this merging contacts stuff? Anyway, we’re gonna tell you that there is a gotcha to this that would happen, especially if you’re running work flows on the backend that rely on contact properties. There are things that get triggered when you merge work flows. So, tell us more, Craig.

– [Craig] Well, I almost wanna say with work flows after just talking about how awesome they are, as we do every episode, it’s kind of like with great power comes great responsibility, so to speak. Work flows, they can be very powerful but they can also have gotchas like this. Now, we actually mentioned this way back I think at the start of the year in episode 149.

– [Ian] Yes, we did.

– [Craig] Where we talked about merging contacts. and basically this side effect that many people I don’t think are aware of. And what it is, let’s say you’ve got contact A and you’re gonna merge it into contact B. Now contact B, let’s say they signed up on the site, they filled in a form and then it sent some thank you emails, put them in a nurture, right? Let’s say they did that a year ago, so that’s contact B and that’s the one you’re merging into. Now contact A might just be a variation of their email address and you happen to notice it because you get one of those nice notifications from HubSpot, thanks for sending those out. So you go along, you go right, I’ll just put HubSpot contact A into B, so you merge it. Bang, suddenly all those work flows that contact B has already been through get triggered again for contact A. And so, this can be quite puzzling, quite distressing for clients, as well. It’s like right, well, how did this happen? Well, here’s the side effect. And you know what? A slight criticism of HubSpot for this ’cause even though they’ve got a support article that talks about potential downsides and we’ve got that linked in the show notes. When they send these emails out saying you’ve got all these contacts to merge and they have that list, they don’t make it clear. There might be a little message, you know, oh be aware that there could be these effects, but I actually think this is a big gotcha and it’s causing confusion for clients and I think it’s gonna be a big problem that HubSpot’s got on their hands. Anyway, how do you get around it? Which, of course, is the key. Now, we’ve got a bit of a workaround and we went through this back in episode 149 and it involves creating exclusion lists. And one of the things you might know in work flows, is you can have exclusion lists or suppression lists that basically if someone is in one of these exclusion lists they don’t go through the work flow. And we have this process with the clients. We have this whole process where if we’re gonna merge contacts, we put those contacts into an exclusion list so that they don’t get triggered into work flows. Or if they do, they’re just excluded from work flow. We put the into those exclusion lists, we then merge the contacts and then we take those contacts out of the exclusion lists. Well, the resulting, finalized contact list. And that’s the way you get around it, so it’s quite manual. You actually have to go through all your contacts and put them in these exclusions lists, then remember to take them out in order to stop this side effect of the work flows. Now, that’s the workaround at the moment. I hope HubSpot comes up with a better kind of option. For example, what I’d love is just when you merge and option that says do not trigger any work flows. As simple as that. That’s really what they need. I think they’ll bring that out ’cause I think there’s gonna be a problem for clients.

– Yes.

– Anyway, that’s the gotcha and that’s the workaround at the moment. Find us in episode 149 shot to for more details on that.

– [Ian] Excellent. Now onto our marketing tip of the week, Craig. No more mixed http and https content messages and Chrome will block http content. So this, listeners, is sites that haven’t been transitioned to a secure… have a security certificate and are secure. And within that, there’s obviously images and other assets that get caught, so previously people might’ve know of this as mixed content warnings where the site might actually be secure but it’s calling as if it’s on an insecure server. And what Chrome does is it basically highlights to you and says oh this is unsafe. Do you wanna proceed, right? So, what have they done, Craig?

– [Craig] Well, this is in an upcoming release. What they’re going to do is instead of just giving warnings they’re just gonna block that resource. Your page loads and let’s say there’s an insecure http resource–

– Yeah, like an image, yeah.

– They just won’t show it. It’ll just be kind of rendered out, yeah.

– [Ian] Rendered out, yeah.

– [Craig] Yeah, so that there’s no chance.

– [Ian] so, I mean, this is really interesting. I’ll tell you why. Because people that haven’t gone through the due diligence and the process of upgrading to a secure site properly are gonna have this problem. Like I’m only telling you this because we have gone through a process with customers over the last few years where we’ve actually gone through, checked all the mixed content warnings, made sure that everything’s being called correctly. And then there are are other people that we’ve dealt with who are just like oh, no, don’t worry, just apply the certificate, don’t worry about it. It’ll all be good. These are the people that are gonna suffer very soon when it comes to these–

– [Craig] Yeah, look and I think it depends on the hosting and also plugins, like in WordPress you can get plugins that force all the resources. One of the things I will say about this upcoming chrome release is that they’re gonna be smart about it. So, they’re going to, let’s say it’s just an http image, so non secure, they will check the https version and if it’s there, that’ll load that instead. So, it’s doing some smarts in the background. Thanks Chrome, that’s actually a good thing. But, if they can’t find the secure, bang, they’re just gonna leave it out.

– [Ian] First thing, make sure you’ve got a security certificate. Second, once you’ve done that check for mixed content warnings and then go through appropriate remediation to get all of that fixed before this rolls out so you don’t get affected. All right, Craig, onto our insight of the week. A little a, what do I call? Our maxim. Test and measure that we always talk about. And thinking of Chris, we just spoke to Chris–

– [Craig] Chris Mottram, our producer who is helping us test and measure to get our audio quality even better. Thanks, Chris.

– [Ian] And this is something that you were telling me over lunch which totally bypassed me, but metrics on videos in Facebook are totally wrong.

– [Craig] That’s right. So let me give you a bit of the background to this just quickly because the background’s interesting but, I guess, the ramifications of it are even more important. So, this all goes back a couple years to when Facebook was rolling out video and are giving stats on average video view time, but they calculated it incorrectly. And I think this goes back to starting in 2015 and the reason it’s came to light is ’cause there was a class action or legal action actually taken against Facebook in 2016 about them incorrectly reporting the stats. Now, just quickly what they had done is in terms of calculating average view time, they were taking all the time that it was viewed and then instead of dividing by the total number of people who might have just started watching. Remember how the videos used to auto play just starting as you were scrolling through? They only divided it by the number of people who were actually called a viewer. So, the kinds of people that watched for at least three seconds or four seconds count as a view. The difference is, if you only divided by that smaller number of people, the average view time looks really high. Whereas if it was divided by actually the number of people that indirectly just started it, then it was must lower. So the point is that their numbers or the metrics were inflated by well, multiples up to, and some people claim 800%, et cetera. So, that’s all the background. Now, that all started in 2016. It’s all come out now recently because it’s part of that ongoing legal action. They’ve had access to internal Facebook communication. Like hundreds and hundreds of pages of emails and so forth. And it turns out, Facebook knew about this for more than a year before they did anything about it. Even though, they’re saying oh sorry, small calculation error. Yeah, we fixed it, minimal effect, right? What’s coming out now is that it was massively overestimated or overinflated numbers and they knew about it for ages. They did nothing about it and they didn’t bother. It wasn’t a concern, right? Okay, so that’s the history. What’s the ramifications of that? The ramifications are lots of things. First of all, people were moving ad budgets from other platforms onto Facebook because you remember a couple years ago everyone’s all like oh video, video is the future, right? And, of course, it is but the numbers on Facebook seemed so good and so cheap, as a result that people were pushing whole budgets away from, say, YouTube and other platforms onto Facebook. And the problem is because the numbers were inflated, they weren’t getting the results they expected. Maybe you’re expecting similar results to what you get on YouTube but it’s not happening on Facebook, et cetera. So, there’s been whole, I guess, marketing budgets pushed into a platform or a medium, which has been false. Like, in fact, not only a mistake, but you could actually say deliberately withheld. So, here comes the question ’cause we are always saying test and measure. How do we test and measure if we can’t actually measure accurately? If we can’t be confident? So that’s what I wanna chat about today in this insight. So, but before we go on, I’ve spoken for a bit there. Did you wanna make any comments about that and maybe some action items from your point of view before I, yeah, go on a bit?

– [Ian] Yes, so I think one of the actions here is we all know that, especially where we work within HubSpot, there’s a little bit of leaks in there. We also always put in the Google Analytics so we have a second point of reference. Now, it might not always be exactly 100% because people measure things differently in terms of what’s the duration that this measurement takes into account before it actually gets measured, which can be different, so give me your different results. But, regardless to say, there are all these different points or analytics packages that we can use to collect data. So if you’re using a particular package to collect data about your videos, then you should be able to tell is the video playback, or the points at which people are dropping off or playing, is it that the same as what’s being reported? That’s essentially what I wanted to say, so like having a second point of reference.

– [Craig] Actually, you’ve highlighted one thing, which is you wanna get them off Facebook onto your site in some point. So, one of the keys to coming around this is not only engagement but actually conversion stats, so you get them to your site. So, you might have a Facebook video but the call to action is to get them to your site so that you can actually compare whether it’s working. So for all those people who moved away from YouTube to Facebook, there should have been an end result, which was is it actually building audiences that drive people to your website, or to some other conversion action, not just an engagement metric. However, your point around having multiple analytics packages is perfect because there’s multiple video platforms. So another, I guess, takeaway from this is don’t just choose one channel and solely put all your budget there. You might start with one channel but then you gotta grow it out. So for example, if you’re running a number of videos on Facebook, run them on YouTube, run them on LinkedIn, run them on twitter. Run them on various platforms and check across each because if Facebook is looking ridiculously good in terms of engagement, perhaps something’s wrong. And this could be any of the other platforms you know, it could be Twitter in the future, it could be LinkedIn, who knows? THey’re probably all gonna have problems, but at least by having multiple platforms that you’re using you can actually compare and work out some anomalies. But then, the main takeaway is you’ve gotta get them back to a conversion action. And by conversion action, we’re ultimately talking about getting an email address. If you can get that, that’s I guess, the goal at the end to compare across the channels.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, on top podcast of the week and this is a business casual podcast from Morning Brew. And Morning Brew is one of the probably of the emails we read every day.

– [Craig] I love this, in terms of a daily email newsletter. We’ve talked about this before. There’s not many I read every day.

– That’s right.

– Morning Brew’s one of them.

– [Ian] Anyway, they’ve got a great podcast and they’ve been interviewing some really interesting people so I would encourage you to listen to it. It just broadens your horizon on the different things people are out there doing and I love it.

– [Craig] Isn’t it interesting how these, we’ll call them news sites, are moving into other mediums? So, Morning Brew, moving away. Not away, but complimenting an email newsletter, which is what they’re famous for, with a podcast. I’m not sure where it was, Netflix maybe the other day, but New York Times, of course, and they have these little video documentaries. I think it’s called “15 Minutes.” Little stories by the New York Times turning what is a written piece into a video piece. And they’re all really good. So yeah, we’re seeing this move into other mediums.

– [Ian] All right, now we’ve got a couple of resources of the week, Craig. Ask Google webmasters, there was a question in there. Is it a problem if my page has multiple hitting one tags? And the answer is–

– The answer’s no. This actually came as a surprise to me ’cause as a longtime SEO, it’s always been look, just trying to have one H1, hitting one, that’s a hitting one, H1. I only have one H1 tag on your site and there still is good reason to do it ’cause Google looks at it as a sign of what this page–

– Hierarchy, right?

– Yeah, hierarchy. But yeah, Google is like no, have as many as you want, that’s fine, if it highlights important things, that’s good. Use it for readability. So we’ve got John Muir from Google Little Webmaster Hangout talking about that in the show notes.

– [Ian] Yeah, and listeners if you don’t know about John Muir and those hangouts that he does, I encourage you If you’re not in your business doing this, share this with the person that is. Because I think there’s some really good information in there that you can often use and pick up. And often a lot of myths get dispelled and what we often hear out there in the marketplace. If you listen to the source and go, oh, hang on, that’s just rubbish. You don’t have to worry about it, right? You don’t have to waste your time thinking about it.

– [Craig] Well, look, let me put a caveat on that. ‘Cause, you know, I’m always cynical about Google.

– [Ian] Yes.

– [Craig] When they give guidance like this, I’m like yeah, okay, that’s fine. But when they give some other guidance, sometimes, I’m like yeah, well, that seems to work well for Google, maybe not for people. Always be running ads on your brand. It’s like yeah, okay, so, I don’t know if that’s the best advice from Google, but yeah.

– [Ian] Anyway, test and measure, I say.

– [Craig] Test and measure.

– [Ian] All right, the quote of the week, Craig.

– [Craig] Okay, so why’d you pick this?

– [Ian] Well, I picked this because you gave me a book. It’s called “The Suit Book: Everything “You Need to Know about Wearing a Suit” by Clare Sheng. And one of the quotes in this book was “Dressing well is a form of good manners.” And it’s from Tom Ford. Now you’ve read this book and you really liked this book.

– [Craig] I really liked this book and and listeners, I’ll just say like I’m your typical nerdy geek, I dress badly… Well badly, I just, I dress comfortably.

– [Ian] Craig, let’s put it this way. You dress comfortably and every since I’ve know you, you have like this, let me say it, you’ve got five shirts that are all the same. But you probably have more, right?

– [Craig] I have 10 shirts.

– [Ian] 10 shirts that are all the same. He’s got 10 T-shirts that are all the same. He’s got three pairs of shoes that are all the same. So, if that’s any indication–

– [Craig] Look, It’s just efficiency. It’s easy. I’m not gonna pretend I’m Barack Obama or Zuckerberg, I’m so busy that it solves decisions. It’s just like it’s easy and it’s comfortable, right? So I’ve been like this anyway. I’m trying to dress better. Can you believe this?

– That’s right.

– I’m trying to lift my game.

– It’s good, I’m impressed.

– We’ll see how it goes.

– [Ian] So far, Craig has gone with a new pair of R.M. Williams. I’m really excited about that.

– [Craig] I’m trying to wear better shoes, better pants, I’m actually getting things tailored now. I don’t know. But anyways, we’ll see how it goes. Actually, why are we telling the listeners this? I don’t know if they need to know this but anyway, this book had an impact. Oh, I know what I was gonna say. ‘Cause this book had an impact on me because we were chatting before, ignorance is bliss.

– [Ian] That’s exactly right.

– [Craig] After reading this how to dress well, now I’m actually like oh my gosh. I’m badly dressed and I notice it all the time, and so ignorance was bliss when I didn’t know. Oh well, I’m trying to improve.

– [Ian] There we go, listeners. Now, there are a couple of bonus links in this show so I encourage you to check it out. What else can I say?

– [Craig] Test and measure.

– [Ian] Test and measure. Well Craig, until next time.

– [Craig] Catch ya later, Ian.

– [Ian] Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news including practical strategies you can implement, visit us as hubshots.com.


Episode 177: HubSpot Deal Stage Properties, Test and Measure (again), Changing your mind

Welcome to Episode 177 of Hubshots!

HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about enforcing deal stage properties, setting social permissions for users, and why changing your mind is a good thing.

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/177-hubspot-deal-stage-properties-test-and-measure-again-changing-your-mind/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

Join the Facebook group here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/hubshots/

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Follow us on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/company/hubshots/

Recorded: Tuesday 08 October 2019 | Published: Friday 25 October 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week

Inbound Session tip, via Chris Higgins from Electric Monk in the UK:


Creating a Deal Lost category dropdown property and then making it mandatory to be filled when marking a deal as Closed Lost.

Hoping Chris chats about this in an upcoming episode of his Inbound Happy Hour podcast

https://wing.com/ – watch the video


Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Draft social post permissions (Enterprise Only)


This isn’t a new feature, but it is something that a number of people don’t realise.

Setting permissions for users to only be able to create Draft social posts – this is managed in User settings (not in Social settings):

Settings 14

A good use case is where a team member has access to your personal LinkedIn profile – you may only want to allow them to create draft posts on your behalf, that you then check before scheduling.

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

(Prompted by Chris Higgins’ note in Shot 1)

Setting Deal stage properties (Sales Pro)

Settings 16

Settings 15

Chris’ note is to make the Closed Lost reason a dropdown rather than a free form field.

Shot 4: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Cloning Custom modules in the Design Tools

You go to a template, which has a custom module on it

You want to create a similar custom module, with just a few tweaks

So, on the template you clone the custom module

And then you edit the cloned custom module

You think you are editing a brand new version of the custom module

But actually you are editing the original custom module and the changes will show in both of the copies on your template

To clone a custom module ie so you can have a separate copy to customise, you need to find it in the list on the left hand side, and then clone it:

Design Manager   HubSpot 3

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Test and Measure

Instagram changing stuff all the time:


Here’s the takeaway: even a massive company with more than a billion users is constantly refining their product because they realise they aren’t delivering an experience users actually want or use.

How do you analyse this in your own business/department?

Takeaway: review your analytics:

  • Which content is working?
  • Which landing pages are working?
  • Which leads are converting to customers?
  • Which emails are getting opened and clicked?


Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Changing Your Mind


Business is the one area of your life where you are paid to change your mind:


Business rewards thinking about things differently – often because it is the only way you’ll be able to stay in business.

Shot 7: Podcast of the Week

Pivot podcast with Scott Galloway and Kara Swisher



Interesting take on all things tech.

Shot 8: Resource of the Week

Email marketing tips


Shot 9: Quote of the Week

“The ratio of time you spend sweating to watching others sweat is a forward looking indicator of your success” – Scott Galloway – The Algebra of Happiness

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week





Tools I’m looking into:



Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.

– [Ian] Hi everyone, welcome to “HubShots Episode 177.” In this episode we talk about HubSpot deal stages properties, testing and measuring again, and changing your mind. You’re listening to Asia-Pacific’s number one HubSpot focused podcast, where we discuss HubSpot tips, tricks and features for growing your marketing and sales results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search and Be Found, and with me is Craig Baily from XEN systems, hi Craig.

– [Craig] Oh good, and you know what I’d love? I’d love to get a delivery by a drone.

– Yes

– You were telling me over dinner tonight, ’cause you were just down in Canberra this weekend.

– That’s right.

– And they’re testing deliveries of incredibly important items.

– [Ian] Doughnuts and coffee, Craig. Plus there are a few other things, some stuff you can get at the chemist. Now, why I’m telling you this is because my mom, who works for the government, hi Mom. And she looks after, she’s part of the team that looks after airports and air spaces. So she was like “Oh, they’re testing drone delivery” and I’m like “What are they delivering?” She said “Oh, you know what the most popular thing is? “Coffee and doughnuts.” And so what they’ve done, they based an industrial area not far from where my mom lives, and they’re delivering to a particular, like a couple of suburbs within that location. I would say flight time no more than about three to five minutes for delivery. And they’re testing it out in Canberra, and it’s gonna be rolled out, so they’re just working out A: what they can be delivering, how they’re managing airspace noise, and so on and so forth. And it’s by a company called, I think it’s called Wing. So, I’ll put the link in the show notes.

– [Craig] These are gonna be everywhere before you know it, aren’t they? It’s gonna be interesting logistics. I mean, we all saw that video from Amazon years ago when that was flying about, and everyone laughed at it. And I guess that kind of did set the scene, but

– Here we are.

– Here we are, and so

– Head down to Canberra.

– This’ll all just be normal soon. So yeah, I don’t know what that’s got to do with HubSpot or marketing, but it’s a very interesting.

– But you know what this is? I was looking at their website, and I think they were saying it’s about giving people access to products that, local businesses access to delivery of their product to people nearby. So, you kinda think, as I was telling you before, this is a good opportunity for businesses, that are local businesses that need to get product distribution, to have that ability to get the product distribution into the hands of people that want it.

– [Craig] Well this is absolutely right. It won’t be long before Google My Business listing, on the things, it’ll have one of the items which says it’ll support drone delivery as something for locals. So yeah, it’s very big for local business.

– [Ian] Yeah so, and you think about how search, we know looking at all the stats, generally people that search in a local area, will generally visit the store within an hour of that search. So, just think about this, if they could get it delivered without visiting the store, and they go “Oh, hang on, we know that store’s got it, “just want it delivered.” Yep, click the button, here we go.

– [Craig] Doughnuts ahoy, so good.

– [Ian] So there you have it. Now Craig, the GroWth Thought of the Week.

– [Craig] Oh, great tip. You know we were chatting with Chris Higgins, hey, shout-out to Chris from Electric Monk in the UK, he was at Inbound.

– [Ian] It’s nice to have friends that are right across the globe. Isn’t it, Craig?

– It is, it is so good. And another fellow podcaster, so he’s, I think we chatted about his podcast

– A while back.

– a little while back. He needs to just increase the frequency just a tad, I’d say. So Chris, I know that’s a, you got plans for a bit of an Inbound recap, so hopefully listeners, by the time you hear our episode, Chris will have recorded another one. But yeah, “Inbound Happy Hour.” Anyway, I got a bit off track then, because what I was gonna say is, we were chatting on email about what was some of his takeaways from Inbound. Said he went to a really cool session around workflows for automating some of those boring sales tasks. I was like “Oh, yeah, okay.” Anyway, he had this really cool idea that a checkbox on a contact record, so the use case would be “Oh yeah, I know that person’s just moved.” Hit a checkbox. That goes into workflow, and actually sets up some automatic tasks assigned to you, or perhaps the contact owner to follow up. So, it’s just one of those things about making sure things don’t fall through the gaps. Anyway, that was a really cool idea. That was on, we’re emailing backwards and forwards. Anyway, then he, onto what I was actually gonna mention in the show, ’cause I just went off on another tangent then, as how I’m want to do. The other thing he was saying is, actually, what was he talking about?

– It was about the deal.

– Oh yeah, creating. Totally getting offtrack. Creating a deal property. So, you might talk about this, cause when we were discussing it earlier, I said “Oh, just seen this idea from Chris” He goes “Ah.” You were actually saying, Ian, “Oh yeah, I’m doing that with one of my clients, “and it works really well.” So, maybe mention what the tip is, and how you’ve implemented it.

– [Ian] Correct, so this is having a contact property where when a deal is lost, you actually find out the lost reason.

– [Craig] Oh, so it’s actually a deal property, not a contact property. Yeah, I’ve gotcha, okay.

– [Ian] Now, you can obviously copy it in there, but when the property’s actually having defined why things get lost in the business that we work alongside with, we know over time of the last year of working with them, we know why they lose deals. Could be budgetary constraints, could be they’ve gone with another builder, maybe they’ve actually lost their job recently, so might actually go on hold. But it might be a reason to get out of that sales pipeline. And so, what we were gonna do is if once we can collect that, what we can actually do is run automation after that to say “Okay well, if we lost it for this particular reason, “let’s maybe send them a ANPS survey “to figure out would that you refer us to friends.” And that’s how we’re using this deal property.

– [Craig] Very cool, so actually there’s a whole bunch of things to unpack here. So the first is, on a deal, you can actually, and we would chat about this in shot three, can sat up a property that must be filled out.

– [Ian] If you have Sales Professional.

– [Craig] Oh, this is Sales Pro, is it? Okay, that’s good to know. But here’s one of the key things, and this was Chris’s main takeaway. Make it a dropdown rather than a free text field, ’cause in our HubSpot portal we actually have it as free text for just putting stuff in. And the key was, that’s actually almost unusable in a way, unless you’re very carefully going through. So, make it a dropdown, so that was cool, but then your point, which is yeah, if you’ve got service hub, you can tap into that based on a deal, and send out further surveys. So yeah, we’ll draw into that coming up in shot three.

– [Ian] All right, on to our HubShot Marketing Feature of the Week, Craig. Draft social post permissions, and this is Enterprise only, Marketing Hub.

– [Craig] Yeah, Marketing Hub. Now, this is not a new feature. It’s been around for a while, actually I think. But something that I wanted to remind listeners of, ’cause I was just talking about this with a client. So the point is, let’s say you have someone on your team managing social for you, and they’re doing it through HubSpot. Now, some people on your team you might trust more than others for various reasons, for various good reasons. And so, for some people, let’s say they’re a junior, maybe they’ve just started. They don’t know, they haven’t understood voice of the company fully. So, you only give them draft privileges. They create draft social posts, and then you’d go back and actually review them before scheduling them out. And so, where I thought this was a really good example, and where it is in our client’s case is, their CEO’s LinkedIn personal profile is managed through HubSpot, and so we don’t want just anyone coming in, posting on the CEO’s behalf, straight on out on their personal profile. By the way, fine to do it on their company profile or other channels, but of course, on LinkedIn. So, there is a case where actually having most of your team as draft only on social might be worth wanting. So, show notes, we’ve got a screenshot. And yeah, implement if that’s a good match for your use case.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, the HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week, and this is thanks to Chris. It’s about the deal stage properties. And so, just be aware, this is to do with Sales Professional. So, if you wanna actually make things mandatory, or make them required fields when they’re filling this out, then you’d have Sales Professional. And one of the things that you would do is select a closed lost reason and a closed lost date. So, that’s really important, and then obviously you can use that in other things like Service Hub, for doing what you need to do. So, great takeaway, and if you can, obviously, make that a dropdown, the closed lost reason.

– [Craig] Cool, thanks Chris, and yeah, a few screenshots in the show notes there.

– [Ian] All right Craig, now HubShot Gotcha of the Week. It’s about cloning custom modules in the design tools. Now, why are we talking about this as a gotcha, tell me.

– Well, because it–

– It got you!

– [Craig] Well, yeah, got us out this week. I’ll give you the scenario. You’re working on a template, right? So a webpage page template. So you go into design tools, you’re in the template, and let’s say there’s a custom module in there, and you’re going “Oh, okay cool, “I’m actually gonna get that custom module, “but I wanna tweak it a bit.” So, you’re in the template, you’ll just go “Ah, I’ll just clone “this custom module in the template. “Okay, now there’s two versions on the template, “but this second one, I’m actually gonna customize. “I’m actually gonna change some things about it, “maybe styles are applied to it or whatever.” So you go edit, custom module, source, and so then you go in there, and you make your changes. So what would you expect to happen In that case?

– Is this after you’ve cloned it?

– [Craig] Okay, so first of all, what do you think cloning means?

– [Ian] Taking an exact copy of it.

– [Craig] Right, so I’ve just cloned it on the template.

– [Ian] Okay, you’ve got a different, you’ve got another custom module on the template.

– [Craig] Well, no, all I’ve done is duplicated it.

– [Ian] Dupiclated the module, yes.

– [Craig] Here’s the confusion. Have I cloned it, or have I just duplicated it on the template? In fact, all I’ve done is duplicated it. I’ve got one custom module, but it’s appearing twice.

– Correct, yes.

– [Craig] Okay, so then, and here’s what’s happened. They’ve gone “Oh, okay.” On this second one, I’ll open that up, edit the source for that custom module, change it, expecting that to work differently. Come back to the template, both of them have changed. Okay, so it’s a bit of a gotcha. So, here’s the point. You actually haven’t cloned to a new custom module. You’ve just got the same custom module twice on your template. If you want to actually clone, like make another version of the custom module…

– [Ian] You have to go back to the file view to clone it, am I right?

– [Craig] Exactly. On the list on the left hand side going right click, I’ll get a screenshot of that. So, it’s a combat cloning and cloning, yeah, can get you caught up.

– [Ian] It’s actually duplication and cloning.

– [Craig] It’s duplicating and cloning, that’s right. But quite often, you’ll talk about something, you’ll just say “Oh, I’ll make a copy of that.” What am I talking about? Am I talking about cloning or am I talking about duplicating? Very confusing, so Gotcha of the Week, I guess the take away is well, know the terminology, but also understand the intent and make sure, yeah, it can catch you out. Hopefully we’ll save one listener sometime.

– [Ian] Yes, that’s right. All right Craig, onto our marketing tip of the week, and this is something we go on about a lot, is about testing and measuring, because things change so rapidly, right? In this, we’re gonna talk about Instagram changing stuff all the time, and USGC on Google as well. Stuff changing all the time. But what did you wanna highlight on Instagram, Craig?

– [Craig] Well, it doesn’t actually really matter what they’ve changed in Instagram, but I’ll tell you what it is anyway. They’re actually removing a part of what followers are doing, well, people that you follow.

– [Ian] Correct, what you’re following, right?

– [Craig] What you’re following, what they’re doing, you can see what they’re liking and that kinda thing. So, it’s a feature in Instagram, its got its own tab actually.

– Correct.

– So, they’re removing that.

– It used to have its own tab.

– Well yeah. They’re removing that because A: no one really used it, but B: you could kinda see some weird things that your friends are doing. Like, why are they kinda liking certain types of posts?

– Yes

– Things like that. So it was kind of a bit of an insight into what your friends are doing, and perhaps your friends having an insight into what you’re doing. Oh my goodness. You know what all my friends, well, I don’t, as you know I’ve got a private Instagram account that no one really can roll over it. All they would see me is liking pictures of cute puppies. They’d be like “Who is this guy? “All he’s rolling is cute puppies.” Oh my goodness. Anyway, so they’re taking it out. That’s a whole aside. Why am I talking about this? Here’s my point. The point is that Instagram, with more than a billion users, massive company, they’re always testing, and they’re actually finding these things that we thought were a great idea. And that I think has been in the product almost since day one.

– A long time, yes.

– [Craig] Yeah, been in there for ages. They actually realized, no, it’s not a good fit. So, if a massive company can’t get it right and has to change continually to remove things that people don’t want, and just shouldn’t have been in there in the first place, then what chance have you got of getting it right? Therefore my point, always be testing and measuring. And so, got a few points about, well what are some of the things you should be reviewing, mainly by looking at analytics, because do you think, how do you think Instagram found out no people were using it? They’ve got all this telemetry on what people are doing, right? HubSpot must do that all the time, that’s why they removed some of our favorite features. We miss you keyword tool. But anyway, what are some of the things that we could be just checking by looking at analytics?

– [Ian] Well, I think the simplest thing is what content is working, and even what channels are working for you. Another one would be what landing pages are working, and which leads are converting into customers. And this is really good for understanding which sources those leads are coming from, and which one of those are converting into customers. And one of the other ones is which emails are getting opened and clicked.

– [Craig] So, pretty simple stuff you can look at. You can look at google analytics, just look at your HubSpot analytics, look at some of those reports.

– Correct

– [Craig] Make sure you’re paying attention.

– [Ian] That’s right, because you just kinda think, I’ll highlight this with a customer we put Hotjar on a couple of weeks ago, and I sat down with him after we clicked through some data, and I showed it to them. They go “Oh, that’s really interesting. “We have this big banner at the top, “and everyone has to scroll past this banner “to get to stuff.” And they’re like “Oh, do we really need that there? “Why don’t we just get rid of the banner “and put some important information at the top?” Well yeah, that’s a good idea. But again, you would not have known that if you didn’t actually have anything to track it and look at what people were doing, and the behavior of people using the site, you would not have that insight.

– [Craig] I read this fascinating article on Conversion XL the other day.

– Yes?

– [Craig] Where they were looking at, oh, we should put this in the show notes, we’ll find the link. But they were at your key points about your business, like what you do. I’ve forgotten the term for it, kinda like key value offerings. And they did this testing, heatmap testing, where they used three different layouts. One they just had three bullet points at the top, we do this, this, and this. Next, they had three bullet points with paragraphs, like a paragraph on each explaining what their core offering was. And then the third, they had these big long paragraphs, so big chunky ones. And they looked at that to see what gave the best recall. You know, they were doing this testing across a whole bunch of people. And I’ll cut to the chase, they found–

– What was the result, Craig?

– [Craig] The second one, a bullet point that had a paragraph underneath it, so the idea being, but not too long, so it was like a sentence or two explaining it. So it’s just like, here’s the core offering and here’s what it means. So very, very quickly, I guess, interpreted for you. Here’s the benefit that you’re gonna get. If it was just a bullet point, people were like, they had to think for themselves, which you know, of course.

– Had to process, yes.

– [Craig] Yeah, and then the end one, they’re too bored by the end of it.

– Correct.

– [Craig] So, just that, anyway, that came around from testing. So, back to your test and measure.

– [Ian] All right Craig, Insight of the Week, changing your mind. And this is about an article on spectator.com

– [Craig] Yeah, on the Spectator. Oh, this is so good. Rory Sutherland, I’ve been reading a lot of his stuff. And he talks about, amongst many that I really like, just think about this idea of changing your mind. Do you think it’s okay to change your mind?

– [Ian] Yeah, I think now that I’ve got a bit of experience, I would say yes. Growing up I would have said no.

– [Craig] What about if you’re a politician, do you think it’s okay to change your mind? I’ll answer for you, no. There’s no way you wanna be subject to changing your mind, ’cause ah, you’re flip-flopping. There’s lots of areas where you don’t wanna change your mind.

– That’s right.

– [Craig] Business is one key area where you do wanna be changing your mind all the time, and so this article is just prompting this whole point, that it’s actually the one place you get paid to change your mind. And I love that.

– That’s fascinating

– [Craig] Further to that, it’s one place where you almost need to be changing your mind, or in the future, you won’t be getting paid.

– [Ian] Yeah, and I think one of the key things you pull, business rewards thinking about things differently, often because it’s the only way you are able to stay in business. Absolute gold, now the Podcast of the Week, Craig. It’s a “Pivot” podcast by Scott Galloway and Kara Swisher.

– [Craig] Scott Galloway, have I mentioned Scott Galloway to you?

– [Ian] You have mentioned Scott Galloway.

– Oh, I just read his book recently, “The Algebra of Happiness”

– Yes.

– [Craig] Almost need a quote of the week for that, Ian.

– [Ian] It’ll be coming up, Craig.

– [Craig] I just thought it was such a good book.

– [Ian] What was the key takeaway, Craig?

– [Craig] Well, he looks at your life, and various parts of your life, and we do have a quote later from it, which I think just captures it really well. Know when you read a book, and the timing is just right for you?

– Yes.

– [Craig] It’s rare, but I love it when that kind of overlap, almost that little Venn diagram of the right time and the right book, and them banging. ‘Cause I could have read this book a couple of months ago, or I could read it next year, and I’d probably go “Oh, this is a pretty lame book, “it’s not great.” But I just read it last week, and I was just like “Oh, this is so good.” I remember I was sending you screenshots from it.

– You were.

– [Craig] Sending you screenshots, it’s so good. Anyway, what was–

– And It was so good, Craig, you actually didn’t ask for a refund on Amazon, did you?

– [Craig] No, I didn’t ask for a refund, thanks. Listeners will know from listening to earlier shows, when I hate books on Amazon, which thankfully happens very rarely, they give you a refund for it. It’s just the best thing. Anyway, he’s got a podcast as well. Oh, by the way, I should tell you what he does.

– What does he do, Craig?

– He kinda analyzes technology and Kara Swisher, she runs the site Recode.

– Ah, yes.

– Yeah, with Walt Mossberg. They’re both very famous technology journalists and analysts. So, she has the podcast with Scott Galloway, and they talk about technology, and Scott Galloway has just been absolutely relentless on the WeWork debacle. So, if you’ve been reading stuff from Scott Galloway around WeWork.

– [Ian] You know what, after you shared that book, I actually started listening to that podcast, and I listened to that exact episode.

– Oh really?

– And I absolutely loved it.

– Yeah.

– So listeners, hear my, I got taken by surprise here on the show notes, but I think when you just explain that, what a good podcast it was. I definitely second Craig and say have a listen to that, because you will learn some stuff that’s actually fascinating.

– [Craig] The podcast is called “Pivot”

– [Ian] All right Craig, now in our Resource of the Week, we’ve got some email marketing tips, and this is off the Databox blog. It’s how to do effective tips for experienced digital marketers, email marketing. So take it out, I’ll tell you why this is great, because email marketing is such a key revenue driver for business. I know we’d send businesses we work with, when we send an email, especially for high end, luxury goods, that one email could generate them 100, 200, $300,000 worth of business, off that one email. And even other businesses that sell cleaning equipment, all sorts of things in the vast variety of people that we deal with, always yields something. Even if the person it goes to has moved on, they’ll get a response saying “Oh, they’re not here, talk to this person.” And that starts a conversation, so I think doing this right, and doing it well, and understanding behavior is a really key aspect to this.

– [Craig] Look, can I just have a little bit of a rant about email marketing? Email marketing is so good, but have you been to talks lately where people say “Oh, we don’t use landing pages and gated content anymore, “it’s all about conversational marketing, “and the chat bots and things like that.” And I’m like “Sure, that’s fine, “not gonna disagree with that.” But then they say “Just forget having gated content “and people signing up for emails, it doesn’t work.” And I’m like “Yeah, I think it does.” And this is why we still do e-box, we work across a bunch of industries, and getting emails build the list, the money is in the list. As I used to say like, what, 20 years ago?

– Correct

– It’s still true, because email marketing works. And articles like this on Databox, where they talk about how to optimize your email marketing are even, therefore, really valuable. What other means can you reach that many people, and get that much cut through. Sure, do the chat bots, and build your messenger marketing, and things like that. Of course, do it, but not at the exclusion, it’s not one or the other. Email marketing is still really alive and well.

– [Ian] Diversity is the key, Craig. All right, Craig, onto our Quote of the Week. “The ratio of time you spend sweating “to watching others sweat is a forward looking indicator “of your success.” And this is from Scott Galloway, from the book “The Algebra of Happiness” Do you wanna elaborate, Craig?

– [Craig] I think it’s pretty self explanatory, but his book is more along those lines. It’s kind of, “The Algebra of Happiness,” its kind of rules for living. And oh, shock horror, you’ve gotta work really hard if you want to get really good results and things like that. I guess I’m very cynical of these work smarter, not harder kinda books, as if you don’t have to do both. They kinda think it’s one or the other. “Oh, all these dummies that are working harder.” No, people are working smarter and working harder. It’s like the norm these days, right? So, his book is in line with that, work really hard, but also, he’s actually big on family now, and relationships. He’s got this wonderful part in it where he talks about how he spent seven months with his mother as she was dying from cancer. And he got to spend that time with her, and let her die and pass with dignity, and really about, it’s just so. Yeah, just read it, it’s just such a good book.

– [Ian] Excellent, now Craig, there are some tools you’re looking at this week. One being Seismic, and the other one being Bitwarden.

– [Craig] Oh man, Seismic, have you seen this?

– [Ian] I have heard of it, I haven’t actually looked at it.

– [Craig] Oh yeah, this is about attribution of your content, right through the marketing to sales. But I’ll talk to you about it offline. I’m really checking it out. I think this is gonna be big.

– [Ian] Fantastic, now listeners, I hope you’ve enjoyed the show. We’d love you to leave us some feedback on Apple Podcasts, and any other platform you listen to this on. And we would love you to share with somebody on your team, or somebody else that you know, that would either be HubSpot or considering using HubSpot. This greatly helps us reach more people. Well Craig, until next time.

– [Craig] Catch you later, Ian. Hey there, thanks for listening to this episode of “HubShots.” For show notes, and the latest HubSpot news and tips, please visit us at hubshots.com ♪ Daddy’s girl ♪


Episode 176: Enterprise Attribution reporting in HubSpot

Welcome to Episode 176 of Hubshots!

HubShots – APAC’s number 1 HubSpot focussed podcast – where we discuss HubSpot tips & tricks, new features, and strategies for growing your marketing results.

This episode we chat about enterprise attribution reporting. Getting emails into HubSpot CRM, Plus is Boris Johnson secretly an SEO guru?

Listen to the episode here: https://soundcloud.com/hubshots/hubshots-176/

HubShots, the podcast for marketing managers and sales professionals who use HubSpot, hosted by Ian Jacob from Search & Be Found and Craig Bailey from XEN Systems.

Subscribe to our YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCD3Uo4X-IxPJLE8ygPDQhNQ

Subscribe to our Spotify channel here: https://open.spotify.com/show/7oee8w41riN5aRNrLKT2ar

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Recorded: Thursday 03 October 2019 | Published: Friday 18 October 2019

Shot 1: Growth Thought of the Week


AUGUST 18-21, 2020 | BOSTON, MA


Interesting organisation of the registration page

INBOUND 2019   Register

The weather in Boston is beautiful in August:


Shout out to Josh from okcloudy.com.

Shot 2: HubSpot Marketing Feature of the Week

Enterprise Attribution Reporting (in beta)


Loving the direction this new Attribution reporting is heading in.

Drill into Deal and then pivot based on sources, content types, content titles, etc

And then drill into the Individual interactions.

You learn some amazing insights based on previous interactions eg check out this journey from initial contact in 2013 through to a deal in 2019:

attribution 1 2

attribution 2

attribution 3

Use the different attribution models to allocate out the attribution across the interactions – I’m really liking the linear model – here’s some example differences:

attribution models

Shot 3: HubSpot Sales Feature of the Week

How to get incoming emails into CRM

To log incoming emails into the CRM, forward them to this email address (123456@forward.hubspot.com), which is your HubSpot Portal ID. Emails forwarded to this address will be attached to any matching contacts. If no contact is found, a new one will be created.


Setup to never log emails from addresses you define in the Email integrations > Log and Track settingsSettings 13

Settings 12Shot 4: HubSpot Gotcha of the Week

Changing Contact property setup, that is used in a Form

If your form uses a field directly based on a Contact Property eg a dropdown list, be aware that changing it at the property level will immediately impact all forms that use it

Can be misleading if you go to edit a form, choose to edit the property, but don’t yet Publish the form.

You may be surprised when you see it live straight away.

Shot 5: Marketing Tip of the Week

Quick implementation with your minimum viable site/product

With Real life anecdote

Shot 6: Insight of the Week

Boris Johnson SEO Expert

boris bus




Shot 8: Resource of the Week

Improve your digital window to the world – a useful tool to understand what Google is looking at when it evaluates site.

Grow My Store


Shot 9: Quote of the Week

Test and measure

Shot 10: Bonus Links of the Week

YouTube optimisation tips for SEO:






Please rate and leave us some feedback as this helps us improve and reach more marketers.


Episode 176 transcription

– [Ian] Hi, everyone, welcome to HubShots, episode 176. In this episode, we chat about enterprise attribution reporting, getting emails into HubSpot CRM, plus, is Boris Johnson secretly an SEO guru, Craig? You’re listening to Asia Pacific’s number one HubSpot focus podcast where we discuss HubSpot’s tips, tricks, and features for growing your sales and marketing results. My name is Ian Jacob from Search and Be Found, and with me is Craig Bailey from XEN Systems. How are you, Craig?

– [Craig] Oh, really good, and wow, what a packed show we’ve got tonight, and I am so excited about this attribution reporting.

– [Ian] I know.

– [Craig] So we’ll get to that in a second.

– [Ian] All right, so now, we’re gonna have our very first growth thought of the week, Craig.

– [Craig] Grow better, Ian.

– [Ian] That’s right, because you know what, INBOUND is, it’s still there.

– [Craig] It’s actually still called INBOUND.

– [Ian] It is.

– [Craig] It’s got that going for it.

– [Ian] And HubSpot is now a platform, and it’s all about growing better, hence the growth thought of the week.

– [Craig] So this used to be called our INBOUND thought of the week, now, it’s our growth thought of the week, is it? And what are we, we’re just, well, basically, we’re just breaking INBOUND anyway.

– [Ian] That’s right, so INBOUND in 2020 is actually earlier in the year, August 18th to 21 in Boston, and you can register, now is a good time. Now, one of the interesting things that I was looking at on the registration page is how they’ve organized it and how they’ve changed the names of some of these tickets from prior years, and I used the Wayback Machine to go and have a look to see what else they had done in prior years. And it’s actually really fascinating, and I’ve a brought a screenshot there how they’ve laid out the pricing page or the registration page with the pricing, and before, it was like a typical pricing page. You know, you got lunch, you got this access to the sessions, you got priority seating, and you had ticks in certain columns. And now, it’s kinda similar, but it’s really interesting how they’ve broken it up, they’ve broken it up into four main categories: inspiration, connection, education, and experience. And they’ve kind of grouped all the features that they’re giving people under these four main areas. What they used to call the VIP Pass is now called a Power Pass, which is another interesting change in how they’re referring, or how they’re trying to be inclusive of people. Maybe VIP just sounded a bit too yesterday, and so now, we’re talking about power, so there you go.

– [Craig] Just gets better and better each year. I haven’t been for a number of years now, but I’m tempted to go back in 2020. I was looking at the weather, and August is kind of like–

– It’s gonna be good, great.

– The pick of the month, it’s beautiful weather in Boston in August.

– [Ian] Perfect to enjoy some clam chowder, and lobster rolls.

– Ah! Lobster rolls and clam chowder, gee, that was the best.

– [Ian] If you’re interested in going, now’s a good time to book, you’ll get a very big discount.

– [Craig] The prices are pretty good actually, yeah.

– [Ian] Yeah, you know what, looking at it over the last years, it hasn’t really increased if you book early. All right, second thing, I’m gonna say a shout out to Josh from okcloudy.com. Thanks for contacting us, Josh, it was good to talk to you and try and help you out. And you know what, we love listeners that reach out to us, don’t we, Craig?

– [Craig] Yes, we do, shout out to Josh.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, onto our HubSpot marketing feature of the week which is the enterprise attribution reporting, and now this is in beta for enterprise portals.

– [Craig] Yes, just to be very clear, this enterprise hub, enterprise marketing hub.

– [Ian] Marketing.

– [Craig] So I’ve been looking forward to this for a while and this is, initial signs are good, as they say, so this is looking good in enterprise reporting. I’ve started playing with it just this afternoon, so I’ve only spent a couple of hours on it so far, but I was very impressed with what I saw. In particular, the way you can drill down on the journey to a deal. Now, we’ve linked to the knowledge base article which just tells you a little bit about it, and there’s a nice video which they walk you through, as well. But in essence, you’re setting up a list of deals to look backwards on. So you’re starting with the deals, and then, working backwards to how you arrive at the deals. And you can do that by a number of ways, deal types, you know, deal pipelines, things like that, content, content types. Now, this is the one that really interests me. And so what you can then do is start drilling into the deals, and I really love this drill-down piece. And you and I were going through one of our deals. I was looking at this, and I was like, “All right!” So that actually, the content types attached to it. It actually started with some email marketing and, well, I’ve got screenshots in the show notes, folks, so you can check this out. This one particular deal started with a contact in 2013. Then you can see the history of them responding to some of my newsletters and automatic marketing workflows, right through, til then you see them coming back to the site pate use and then, bang, or request a meeting, then a deal getting created right through to a deal closing. It’s just a fascinating journey and if you’d said to me before, you know that deal you did earlier this year, I’d go, oh yeah, how’d they find out about you? I’d go, ah, well, I think it was such-and-such. The data doesn’t lie, you can go back and drill into this stuff; I just found it fascinating.

– [Ian] It’s very powerful, isn’t it, Craig? And I think what was really interesting is to see that person’s journey over time, how they responded to your email marketing, the pages they visited on the site, and then what led to them actually requesting a meeting and booking that with you. So, you know what, it just goes to show, people are all on a journey, they’re not ready to buy right now and it’s all these little touchpoints along the way that’s actually making them get to where they are. Now, there are different models which was interesting in this whole attribution reporting, the model that I had never heard of like the U-model and the W-model. The ones that were most commonly known which you probably see in Google Ads is like the linear, the first touch, last touch, and if a few others which is really interesting. So, it goes to show, models that you obviously utilize also place different importance on all those touch points. So, something to be aware of but this is a great start. I’m really excited to see this.

– [Craig] I am too. So, I actually, this is the start of something big because I’ll just highlight, in the individual interactions, which you go back reviewing, there’s, of course, the marketing pieces. Well, one of them is sales emails, so you can actually see, well, in our deals, they often, the sales email is a key part towards the end of the deal, right, which kind of makes sense. That would definitely be the case in B2B, less so in B2C, of course, but you can actually drill in and see it and one of the, and I actually am going to choose linear, I think, for my attribution, by default.

– [Ian] Yep.

– [Craig] Because apportions it even across all the interactions.

– Correct.

– [Craig] And that’s the way I would start but you know what I’d like to see in this in the future is being able to tailor the attribution based on content types. So, I’d like to actually give some attribution to marketing because there’s multiple touches of, say, email marketing or automated marketing. So, multiple touches along the way, and if you see the journey on the screenshots I’ve got, you see how it’s apportioned out meaningly but I’d almost like to say apportioning a piece per a type because then you could see, well, if there was a lot more of that interaction that went on, that it actually contributed a lot more in terms of the revenue contribution. All that kind of breakdown and customizing, I’m assuming that’s going to come, that’s the real power. But for some of our clients, especially in B2B when they’re look at this whole ABM approach, the account-based marketing, trying to look at, well, what part did marketing play versus sales and how they interact and the timelines, it’s getting there. Like, it’s not there yet but it’s getting there. I think this is really powerful and I can tell just from the way they’ve laid it out, you can tell this is how HubSpot is using it, to analyze the deals and look back. Oh, the other thing I’ll highlight, and you’ll see this from the screenshots is, why is this different, say, to just revering a contact timeline? It’s because, you get the deal, it’s pulling in all the contacts and so you actually see them interacting. So it’s almost like a deal timeline in a way but you see them interacting on the key interactions that contribute overall to the deal. Just seeing that in one place and being able to drill, it’s really cool, like, this is really cool. And for high ticket items, you know, if you’ve got clients or you’re a business which has high ticket items, so you’ve not got thousands of deals but maybe you’ve got hundreds or tens, you would actually go into each deal, drill back, check the attribution, oh, I’ll change the attribution model, I’ll just see how it plays out. Oh, how did paid advertising fit into this, et cetera, et cetera. You would just spend a day a month doing this and the insights you’re going to get and the way this pulls it all together, this is really cool. Like, this is big.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, go to HubSpots sales, feature of the week. And this is how to get incoming emails into CRM. Why I’m going to tell you this is that I’ve had a few people this week ask me this question because we’ve been implementing CRM in a few businesses, one of them moving from Salesforce into HubSpot, and the other one moving from not actually having any CRM into HubSpot. But what’s really interesting is that there are certain things because people have obviously got lots of stuff and they’re like, well, how do I get this email in; so, obviously, the really simple way is if you’ve got the HubSpot’s sales ad in your email, reply and go in. Let’s say we don’t want that but we want to store something against that contact but we’re not replying to it and it might have happened previously. There’s actually a forward address which is usually your portal ID at Forward.HubSpot.com and that will forward it into and put against the contact record. And if the contact record doesn’t exist, it’ll create it like it usually does. So be aware of that. Here’s a bonus: do you remember when you’ve got the sales ad in or HubSpot sales extension? You actually have to check your login track settings and you put down, generally, let’s say you don’t want emails in your business to be tracked, so you put down, I don’t want to log anything that is at Xen.com.au, right.

– [Ian] Like internal emails, yep.

– [Craig] So now, you can actually do this in the settings of the login track section within your portal where it’ll never log emails in this domain or that email address. So, I’d encourage you to actually do that in your portal, if you’ve actually got that set up.

– [Ian] That’s good, so you’re highlighting that because it didn’t use to be there, as far as we know. You could do it at the email client end, in the plugin, but, yeah.

– Correct.

– [Ian] Within the portal, I don’t know, or maybe it has been there, we just didn’t notice it but when you pointed this out, I was like, no, I didn’t know about that.

– [Craig] Well, I only stumbled upon it when everyone was asking me questions.

– [Ian] It’s almost like bug bound to you, you know, you’re hunting for something, like, oh yeah, here’s a cool new setting just hidden away in HubSpot, it’s great.

– So, there you have it.

– [Ian] That’s the sales pitch of the week and, Craig, onto our HubSpot gotcha of the week is…

– [Craig] This is by design, so this is not a bug but it is a gotcha. So, I had this with a client, we’ve got a landing page that’s got a form on it and the form includes a field which is where you can select, I’m interested in XYZed, tick, tick, tick, and that’s a contact property. Anyway, so she was saying I want to add an item to the list, I was like, yep, sure, walking her through. Okay, edit the page; okay, good. Edit the page, right, now click on the form, great. Edit the form, oh, okay. So now I’m taken to the form editor, great. Okay, click on that field, okay. Oh, now, that’s actually based no a property, I’ll go and edit the property. Click and that opens the property editor. Oh, good, so I’ll just add that in here, yeah, that’s fine. So, adds the new entry, goes back to form editor, okay. Should I publish this now because we don’t want this going live till next week? I’m like, oh no, well don’t publish now. All right, go back to the page, refresh, oh, it’s there. So, you followed the flow, you can see that use case. Now, I was like oh, why has this happened? Oh, it’s a contact a property, it’s not actually just a property in the form because, remember, in the form, her user experience is, I’m editing the form, I haven’t clicked publish or update on the form. As far as I’m concerned, I’m just still editing the form. And, bang, that is live because the form is based on a contact property.

– That’s right.

– [Craig] So that’s the gotcha, folks, be aware of that. If you’re editing a form that’s using a field based on a property, contact property in settings, then any changes to that property will go live and sitewide wherever it’s used on any form immediately.

– [Ian] It’s funny, when you spoke about this, I was like, I’d be working through a stack of forms and workflows and a whole bunch of things with a customer this week because they’ve changed their mind and a few things. Like, oh, we want this to say this and I’ve noticed this happening, so I was well aware of it but it can catch people out, so be aware of that. All right, Craig, onto our marketing tip of the week.

– [Craig] And I want to talk about this is about having quick implementation with your minimum viable site, if you’re talking about websites or your product. So you probably know that, over time, people had to build, like, the way we do stuff has totally changed and the way we create things, the way we interact, the way we test and measure, one of the things we talk about often is testing and measuring what we’re doing, so we actually have a base that we start off at and we try to start off quite quickly, we don’t wait around for things and we try to get things live, we try to test it, we try to drive traffic, we test, we change, we iterate, so we use things like hot-jah to do stuff. But why I want to highlight this is because I’ve been stuck with a customer of ours trying to get things right. And just not going live and saying, oh, I need to change this email now, I want to change this site, I don’t like the way this button looks. And we’ve been ready for a while and you’re kinda going, we’ll what are we doing, we should be testing this because we can actually iterate and test things and make things better. What should you do if this is happening? You need to actually be aware or have a really clear goal of what you want to see happen. And I think when haven’t got a really clear goal and a timeframe of when you want to see things live, you can continue changing stuff forever. Like, you can always find things to change and fix. It’s the whole 80/20 rule or 99/1 as I would say here, is that you need to get that thing live. If you don’t, you’re going to miss the boat. Like, people have come and gone and finished before that started.

– [Ian] It’s almost like, if only there were an approach to this that people could follow, some new approach to web development; we should really get on to Luke Summerfield about this.

– That’s right.

– [Ian] People might remember that. I think our very first episode was–

– [Craig] It was about growth-driven design.

– [Ian] And it’s exactly this approach of getting a minimum viable site live and then iterating based on testing and iterating based on data, based on actual it’s working. And you’re absolutely right, the people that sit there until they get, they think the site’s perfect, to holding off and holding off until it’s perfect, it’s like, well, for starters, their view of what perfect is never matches what the market’s view is. But, too, it’s almost like it’s, oh, I don’t want to take money yet, I will not take money yet, please do not give me money yet, I’m just holding off and, you know, and so, and it’s also frustrating for us working with clients and, well, you, in this case. So yeah, so what’s the takeaway here? It’s about actually finding that balance, isn’t it?

– [Craig] Correct, totally.

– [Ian] You don’t want to put a site out there that’s rubbish–

– Rubbish.

– [Ian] And a bad perception, of course, we’re not saying that and typos and, of course, fix all that kind of stuff but this idea of finessing and making layouts absolutely perfect or CTO wording or stuff absolutely perfect, you’ve got to get over yourself and get it out there and I’m almost preaching to myself in this way–

– [Craig] Yeah, and look, we have the tools at hand today to actually change stuff really quickly, so think about previously where you might have got stuck and you have to go I have to get the developer to do that. Really, when you thin about, especially with HubSpot, we have tools, we can change CTAs, we can update pages, we can publish new things, we can change the heights of certain elements relatively quickly, right. So the speed to iterate is very, very fast and I think just be aware of that, like, if you are taking your sweet time, you’re missing that opportunity.

– [Ian] All right, Craig, onto our insight of the week, the classic Boris Johnson SEO expert.

– [Craig] Oh, this is hysterical. So, Boris Johnson, yes, we’re talking about the Boris Johnson–

– That’s right.

– [Craig] Prime Minister. So, there’s this article we were just reading recently in a Twitter thread about it and about the genius of the man in his SEO. So, with this high expect, you remember when he was talking about I build model buses or I like to build model buses and everyone was like, what is this guy smoking it’s just the craziest thing. Anyway, turns out, in a genius piece of Google ranking misdirection or manipulation, he was trying to remove focus of the bus which was to do with Brexit, right. And then another thing around model, he used to, he had some altercation with a model and then another one, a more recent example, you can see these in the thread, trying to distance himself from police altercations and things like that. So, the whole, these interviews he does and the crazy things he’s saying are all to drive headlines that then change Google’s results listing away from bad stories about him previously related to those topics to these new, kinda crazy ones in a way and it’s about capturing attention and controlling that capture of attention. And the guy–

– The guy’s a genius.

– [Craig] When I saw this, I was like, who is this guy’s SEO team? Whoever’s doing this, it’s like, and I just would love to have been a fly on the wall when they were discussing this, you know, so, like Boris, we’ve got this idea. We’re going to line up this TV interview with you. Now what we’re going to try and do is a bit of reputation management SEO to get away from the whole bus Brexit coverage and things, so we want you to say, I like to build model buses and the guy is, can you imagine sitting in the interview just always joking and I go, no, I reckon people are going, and the last laugh is with this guy, he has, like the balls on this guy to do it, carry it on. And the other thing is like, how many other times has he done this that we don’t even know, not aware of? The guy is a master, I’m just, I bow down to you, sir. Anyway, that is–

– [Ian] Phenomenal when you think, you look at the search results pages and you see what’s on there and he was funny, even you were telling me about this because I actually read this and I thought, I kinda just had a think about it and thought, wow, the extent that he has gone through, his team has gone through to really understand how to protect himself online and kind of carve up that real estate was really pretty phenomenal. So, you’ve got to sometimes think differently, don’t you, Craig?

– [Craig] Have a look at the bus, we’ll share the bus on Twitter, I reckon.

– [Ian] All right, now Craig, under resource of the week we have…

– [Craig] This is an interesting thing you have been working with on Google, the Grow My Store, it’s called. But they say it’s to improve your digital window into the world, a useful tool to understand what Google is looking at when it evaluates sites.

– [Ian] Hang on, hang on. Improve your digital window to the, why do they write that kind of rubbish? Improve your digital window to the, what does that even mean? That’s just complete malarkey.

– Malarkey.

– [Craig] Anyway, what I wanted to highlight, especially if you’ve got an online store or your store is actually to drive people to a retail, a physical retail space, I do that on one of my customer’s sties and I was showing you the report. It was very interesting once I put it in, it said this report will take a couple of hours to complete. Anyway, we went away and came back, half an hour, it was here. The way it was laid out was very interesting, very visual, really clear. Giving a really clear, this is good, this is not good, and it’s really interesting some of the things it picks up. Like, one of the things I showed you was looking at next to this sort, there was nowhere where it mentioned next day delivery or free returns and that were two of the criteria that Google was actually highlighting that you should be targeting. It looks at site speed, it looks at mobile friendliness, it looks at usability, how good are the pictures, how well the buttons are laid out so it’s easy to buy, can you create yourself an account, et cetera.

– [Ian] It’s kind of like website grader with a few tweaks for an online store, it’s really good. I think it’s really kind of interesting that it said, oh, it’ll take a few hours to prepare your report because what was the perception you had when you saw that?

– [Craig] I was like, really, does it really take that long to produce a report?

– [Ian] Yeah, well of course, it doesn’t and I’m sure it’s prepared in an instant but there’s a perception piece there isn’t there?

– Yeah, you know–

– [Ian] It’s kind of like saying, I’ll take a few hours. Oh wow, this report must have value.

– [Craig] There is a lot of value there, you’re absolutely right. I think that’s exactly what it is. You know how people talk about fake scarcity and fake urgency, that’s kind of like fake credibility it’s building you right there, isn’t it?

– [Ian] That’s right. Now, Craig, you’re supposed to have a quote of the week. Well, you called it genius of the week.

– [Craig] Oh, that’s because we moved the Boris Johnson thing to earlier, sorry.

– [Craig] Well, we don’t have a quote.

– [Ian] Well, the quote this week is, test and measure.

– [Craig] Test and measure, a great quote.

– [Ian] Now, we’ve got some links, YouTube optimization, tips for SEO, now this is really good. I would actually recommend you guys have a look at it. There’s a slide show on it. More and more, I’m actually realizing that people are using YouTube and talking about it more often and, look, I’ll talk about my kids. There is no TV, YouTube is TV in their world. And they get everything, they watch gamers trying to, how to build stuff, what other people are doing. It’s quite funny, they used to watch really silly stuff, now they’re becoming more strategic with what they’re watching because they’re playing different games or even different things at school, and so they’re trying to figure out, well, how do I get better at this, so I watch other people doing it, learn about things that they’re doing and then, basically, mimic that.

– Game better.

– Game better, that’s right.

– [Craig] So do your kids watch it and see ads.

– [Ian] Yeah, they do, actually, so I’m thinking of paying to not see ads.

– [Craig] Yeah, so I’ve got YouTube premium and not that I actually watch a lot of YouTube, I have to say, but there’s no way I can tolerate ads. So that 10 bucks or 12 bucks a month is a no brainer for me to save, well, probably, what, the number of videos I watch. Like, what do you normally get, a minute of ads for a reasonable video? So watching Brian and Diamesh’s keynotes or a few things like that, you’d be like, oh. So I probably save 10 or 15 minutes a week, I reckon, of my time and just the frustration, I’ll happily pay for that. So, I can’t believe people watch all these ads, like, how do you put up with ads in–

– [Ian] I’m just more tolerant, Craig.

– [Craig] Are you more tolerant, is that what it is? Is it the price that puts you off?

– [Ian] No, I actually don’t even know the price, to be honest, I was going to ask you that question.

– [Craig] I think it’s really cheap, it’s like 10 or 12 bucks a month.

– It is.

– [Craig] You know what, I’ll tell you this, I mean, I do subscribe to some other channels where you can have an option to have ads and pay less or have no ads and pay more, and it’s really interesting because on that particular time, we’ve actually, my wife and I, we’ve actually said, oh, we’ll just try it with the ads. And then after about a week, we’re like, oh, we’ve had enough of this, we’ll just pay the extra five bucks and not with ads, so it’s the same. I actually see ourselves going towards that model of actually paying for YouTube because I’m happy for my kids not to have ads and waste their time but just the plethora of ads that are going on, sometimes I want to protect them from stuff.

– [Ian] Yeah, I know, I think there’s two types of ads. So I’m happy to see ads in the sidebar but when they interrupt and stop me doing stuff, that’s when it annoys me. So I do use an ad blocker on some sites but my point is, I’m actually happy to pay for removing ads and, normally, when I have the ad blocker, it’s to remove those ones that really slow down your site or make it completely unfriendly to read the site. I love it when they’ve just got a small ad or a small sponsored listing, I’ll happily look at that and in emails as well, they’ll have an ad. They’ve got to monetize, I’m not expecting it for free and I think this whole idea of micropayments and micro, I will happily pay for that kind of stuff. We subscribe to stuff to remove ads, some of them, the better media newspapers, I’ll happily pay but, yeah, it’s the interruption, it’s just not worth it.

– [Craig] Well, folks, I hope you’ve enjoyed the show. We’d love you to share it with somebody that you think it would help and leave us any feedback and reviews on Apple podcast or–

– [Ian] You know we’re on Spotify now.

– [Craig] And we are on YouTube. You can actually listen to our podcast on YouTube.

– [Ian] What happens with ads there–

– And on Google podcast.

– And Google podcast.

– [Craig] And we’re appearing in the Google listings because we’re getting transcribed and everything, thank you, Mr. Google. So we’re testing that out–

– [Ian] So can I just check us on YouTube, people might actually listen to our podcast on YouTube and be interrupted by ads.

– Quite possibly.

– [Craig] Yeah, sorry folks, we’ve got no control. We don’t have any control over that, do we?

– [Ian] No.

– [Craig] We’ve got no control over that.

– [Ian] We should monetize that, Craig.

– [Craig] Oh yeah, buy the way, stick around, folks, we’ve now got a series of five minutes of ads from our sponsor.

– No, we don’t.

– [Ian] Well, I hope everyone has a great week and we look forward to talking to you next week. See you, Craig.

– Catch you later, Ian.

– [Craig] Thank you for listening to this episode of HubShots. For show notes, resources, HubSpot news including practical strategies you can implement, visit us at HubShots.com

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